To: K-list
Recieved: 2003/10/17 12:29
Subject: RE: [K-list] beliefs
From: Goran Starcevic
On 2003/10/17 12:29, Goran Starcevic posted thus to the K-list:
Quoting Mystress Angelique Serpent <Mystress AT_NOSPAM fire-serpent.com>:
> Why does E need to be consistent? Few are...
Consistency is one of the prerequisites of any system which tends to be
optimally operative with, within a 'reasonable model' (eg. physical reality).
Now, if E is not building anything (system for example) or if he is not
striving towards operativity or if his 'model' transcends logic as you
suggested then he doesn't need to be consistent.
In short -he doesn't and I presumed wrong. Obviously, I must be more carefull
with presumptions.
> Hmm... would you be specific in your examples?
Earth being flat presumption for example.
> > > The basic essence of this argument is that Elargonauto trusts his
> > > gut instincts and you do not.
> >
> >The later is pretty much true. But I would rather define the
> >essence as questioning 'justifying' from a higher chakra
> >perspective of something seen as absurd from a lower chakra
> >perspective.
>
> I think you wrote that backwards?
No -that was what I meant. You're implying purpose (quote: "The purpose may
become apparent later") and I understand/see that as 'justifying' in a way.
> It is usually the ego that seeks
> justification, the Zen mind just acts. The purpose may become apparent
> later, it may be known without needing to think or justify, or it may never
>
> be known. We cannot see all the ripples.
>
> Your wanting E to justify his opinions is odd, and it is not about him,
>
> it is about your wanting. It is what people do, projecting their issues
> onto someone who triggers them. Someone else wants me to justify my
> opinions on what makes a Shaman... while making it clear that they think
> their own opinions are superior, and seeking popular support for
> themselves. Its a similar game, their game, and it not about me...
> transparently so, in that I am spoken of in the third person ("she") as if
> I am not here to speak to, directly.
> It has no relevance to me, except to mention it as an example of how
> demanding justification in the guise of pretending to be seeking
> understanding, can be a kind of interrogator game played by the ego issues
> of the third chakra.
That's what unfortunately happened when I 'just acted' -I started doing it and
now I learned I spent energy and annoyed here just because of my third chakra
issues. I also learned that I could have learned it with simple simulation in
my head without annoying here and spending so much energy. My wanting?! I don't
even know what I want! Ironically, I was the one speaking of consistency ;)
> >Think of every second lunatic (being or not, independent of
> >the definition) in a mental institution saying he is 'Mother
> >Earth', God himself, Jesus Christ or whatever -
> >that may very well be true in reality other than physical, but
> >what is the use of saying that other than wanting to be put in
> >a mental institution from people not aware of the higher truth?
>
> In your judgment, the experience of being enlightened and
> institutionalized is inferior to the experience of being unenlightened and
> "free." I'm not sure you can really make that value judgment unless you
> have experienced both.
Who says they're enlightened!?
> >Just like above. Or am I wrong?
> What? ;) You are expecting me to understand you, heh. What part of
> above? Please clarify.
Just like repeating stuff like "love and light" over and over.
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