To: K-list
Recieved: 2002/01/04 15:56
Subject: [K-list] Dark night poll
From: Druout
On 2002/01/04 15:56, Druout posted thus to the K-list:
Dear List,
In doing a search of items I'd saved on Dark night, etc, I found the
following poll by Sharon Webb that has never been tallied or put on the
file/polls site! It has some wonderful insights from both present and past
members.
If others want to add their experiences, I'll include them as an addendum to
the poll.
Love, Hillary
Date: 7/18/99
From: Sharon Webb
Are you ready for another mini-poll?
If so, how many of you have experienced what you consider to be a "dark
night of the soul?"
And if you did, what happened? How long did it last? And did it occur
before or after K started?
Sharon
****************
Sharon..what a rich question!! Yes I will have to say that I have
experienced the DN. I was born K-active and know that I have been in the DN
for a long time.....:) The DN is where we confront all of our beliefs,
values, our definitions etc....where we truly meet God. The DN comes and
goes in cycles and eventually they grow smaller and smaller as circles in a
drop of water.....For me the DN is the Spiritual mental side of the K. Same
coin .. different sides so to speak. In the DN it is our ego which is being
reformed to a more spiritual role...depression comes into play as the ego
does not want to be changed ...it likes its supreme position :) I have
tried many things to speed along my experience of the DN....I can say that
meditation, prayer, and faith in God...(however God appears to you) is what
brings us through....the best quote I can give you on this is from Ron Roth.
"In the DN God takes away the good in order to give us the BEST."
I can see the light at the end of the tunnel within my DN. I would like to
hear more of what others are experiencing with the DN.
************
my DN preceeded becoming k-active. the DN led me to renounce a self-willed
life and call on the soul for answers. the DN lasted for years but was not
constant (i would have committed suicide if it was). in the midst of the DN,
i was given the financial abundance that i thought i lusted for but found it
led to more problems.
so like most people, i called on a higher power when life was in disarray. i
was given a 'vision' and followed that vision to an adept who gave me the
gift of Shakti online. as a pragmatic business person, i had never seen a
full color vision before but intuitively went to the web after receiving it.
btw, i had been involved with mystical exercises prior to the DN but now
understand that an essential ingredient (Kundalini) was missing all along.
love and light,
***********
Mine occurred after realization of oneness, of God, of all there is (I call
it ''my three-hour tour")... K was extremely active for approximately 9
months prior.
After realization, a like occurrance of *birthing* labor happened - there
were days of extreme bliss, then days of (ewww) darkness/separation/nothing,
which overall lasted 25 days. The days (bliss/dark) became shorter and
shorter - expansion, contraction, expansion, contraction - it was very
noticeable to me as a likeness to labor.
What I had assumed was to be a most beautiful and wondrous birthing
experience of Self, and a repeat performance of my mystical experience of
God became the MOST frightening thing anyone could ever experience -- facing
yourself in all its illusions -- seeing the ego and its workings, the world
and its illusions. It was too much to bear -- the remembrance of how long
*I* had been here, how robotic the world is and how we pull each others
strings, just as puppets. I took it as *truth* instead of lifting the
veil.
I thought I had failed God and myself because I wasn't strong enough to
look at this with *open eyes*.
This sent me for a tailspin in a downward angle for 6 months, where I felt
completely disconnected from God. Nothing I could do would help me
*connect*. I felt I was being punished, banned. My external life was also
in chaos, but none of that mattered. I only wanted to *feel* God in my
life once again, but there was no one there. It was THE worst experience of
my
life... even moreso than when a little less than a year later, I experienced
insanity trying to reach God when my crown chakra blew once again. At least
when I was *insane*, I knew God was with me. The Dark Night of the Soul is
truly soul-wrenching, where I would literally wake up during the night
sobbing or moaning because of the separation I felt.
Six months later, the dark night was lifted. I felt connected once again.
Nothing external happened... it was some sort of an internal shift. During
this horrid 6 months, many wonderful and beautiful healers appeared in my
life - reiki masters, love healers, healers that worked with angels, etc. -
all offering their gifts of love and healing that I hadn't (externally!)
asked for. Looking back, I can see I was never disconnected... but the
feelings I had, caused by my own assumption that I failed God in some way,
caused the separation.
*********
and I have experienced more than one dark night...the first was almost 2
years and the minor episodes have been no more than a few months....I think
for me it is the cycle of death and rebirth, over and over again...always a
new me to be birthed.
><And if you did, what happened? How long did it last? And did it occur
>beforeor after K started?
Oops! I answered that above...2 years at first...the big one after K
started, but I had a dark winter of the soul years prior to active k being
an undeniable force.
> The days (bliss/dark) became shorter and
>shorter - expansion, contraction, expansion, contraction - it was very
>noticeable to me as a likeness to labor.
I completely identify with your birthing/labor analogy!
>...This sent me for a tailspin in a downward angle for 6 months, where I felt
>completely disconnected from God.
Boy, I've been there!
> Nothing I could do would help me
>*connect*. I felt I was being punished, banned.
That is such the way we are inclined to interpret isn't it? Reward and
punishment for being good or bad? But after a while we see that is our
illusion.....that there is no separation in darkness. It is only our
perception of darkness "disconnecting us" that leaves us feeling separate
and alone. I think for me I had to experience God in the dark night....to
experience that this too was love....and such tender attentive love at that.
I had to get there.
>My external life was also
>in chaos, but none of that mattered. I only wanted to *feel* God in my
>life
>once again, but there was no one there.
Doesn't that make you wonder about our preconcieved notions of what God
should FEEL like?? Just me opinion here, but I think our attempts to box
God into catagories perpetuates the experience of the disconnectedness of
the dark night. We get out of a box to find another box we've made....at
least, I'm speaking from my expereince here.
>>At least
>>>when I was *insane*, I knew God was with me.
YES!
I absolutely love that last sentence. May I say "amen" to that! I'd love
to quote that! Beautifully put!
> Looking back, I can see I was never disconnected... but the
>feelings I had, caused by my own assumption that I failed God in some way,
>caused the separation.
I personally agree with your conclusion just based on my own experience.
Thank you for sharing, and these polls are great!
********
>and I have experienced more than one dark night...the first was almost
>2years and the minor episodes have been no more than a few months....I
>thinkfor me it is the cycle of death and rebirth, over and over
>again...always anew me to be birthed.
yes, me too..
>I completely identify with your birthing/labor analogy!
There is a phase of K. that is exactly that.. you relive your own
birth.. die, and spend some time in Hades... till you have forgiven all
your stuff, and find the light again.
For me it kinda happened all at once, and I'll remember that night as the
best and worst of my life.. LOL!! But it also took well over a year to
complete itself, entirely.
Every kundalite is individual, but I have observed many common events
with this phase of K.
It can be compared to the "hero's journey". Joseph Campbell liked to
write about it a lot.. The story of Dante's descent into Hell is an
excellent metaphor, and so is the Quest for the Grail in chapel Perilous,
the Descent of Inanna into the realm of her sister Eriskriegel.. death and
rebirth.
The doorway to the Void, the doorway to the deep unconscious, the veil of
separation, and the door into death are all one. The void is terrifying in
exact proportion to your uncleared Karma.. it is a reflection of your own
fear. This is a protective mechanism to keep the seeker from crossing too
soon. The leap is not made, till the faith to succeed is in place. "Yea tho
I walk thru the valley of death.." Essentially, the death of the
ego-individuality. For sleepers, this happens at physical death.. for
kundalites, we die by shredding the veil of separation.. we go into the
light and come back to live in the body, as light.. Spirit having a human
experience.
Following death, the body experiences re-birth.. literally being born
again.. into the same body..The seed of light that is awakening, come into
the womb of potential that is human, bears fruit.. a body which feels brand
new, because usually one aspect of the experience is a hallucination of
one's physical body dying, decaying or being cremated, and being absorbed
back into unity with the Earth. What once was the body of an individual,
becomes part of grass roots, flowers and earthworms.. part of the Wheel of
death and rebirth. As the body is absorbed back into the Earth, it becomes
part of the Earth, and the stars, and All that Is.
Kundalites are as individual as snowflakes, so the order of these events
is sometimes mixed up.. but one part of this journey is the Dark Night. The
journey thru the underworld. Dante had to descend all of the levels of
hell, with unconditional love and unconditional forgiveness for everything
he encountered there, to find the exit at the center.. which is a marriage
bed into Unity with the Divine, and a teleportation portal into the light.
Anywhere along the journey that is a path thru what is yet unforgiven,
one may become trapped by fear.. stuck in the separation of Hell.
Hypnotised by the Chapel Perilous funhouse mirrors of fear, trying
hopelessly to change or deny the reflection with ego-reasons because the
judgments it represents are uncomfortable... but being blocked from unity
by them, is more uncomfortable, still...
Only the Knight who is pure of heart may survive the traps and attain the
grail.. only those who are without fear may pass under the flaming sword
into Eden. After ego-death, the remaining illusions of separation come up
to be surrendered and released. The journey is a purification, to prepare
for eternal unity.
Of course, we all _do_ make it, coz Goddess provides plenty of angels
and helpers and guides along the path.. altho some do get sidetracked quite
badly, into paranoid realities, there are still people like me who think
the underworld is a kewl place, and return to hang out there to offer a
helping hand to stuck travellers. ;)
The advice for travelers that was posted on the Gates to Hell, in Dante's
inferno, is excellent: It reads "Abandon all hope, ye who enter here".. The
underworld is a timeless place, where every attachment to anything must be
surrendered to Divine Will. In that place, hope shows it's duality: as fear
of the future, and attachment to outcomes that takes one out of seeing
perfection in the Now. Hope becomes an attachment, a funhouse mirror trap.
No hope for the Dead.. only love, forgiveness and faith.
>> I thought I had failed God and myself because I wasn't strong enough to
>look
>>at this with *open eyes*.
>>This sent me for a tailspin in a downward angle for 6 months, where I felt
>>completely disconnected from God.
>Boy, I've been there!
You are both dead women who have been to hell and back..:) Dead and
gone into the light, and the light has become who you are.
I suspect that the "Dark night" is simply normal non-awakened state..
where the sleepers live, disconnected.. but for us who have grown
accustomed to a personal relationship with the Divine, it feels like we
have been pulled suddenly.from the breast. The separation is much more
painful when one has known unity, however briefly.
>>At least when I was *insane*, I knew God was with me.
Yeah tho I walk thru the funny farm, I will not worry coz Thou art
with me. :)
>>Looking back, I can see I was never disconnected... but the
>>feelings I had, caused by my own assumption that I failed God in some way,
>>caused the separation.
Yes, precisely so.. the traps are self-created. Goddess doesn't judge.
I got into a different trap.. the night I re-experienced my own birth and
teetered on the edge of the void terrified, the refusal to surrender was
predicated on the idea that Goddess doesn't judge, and also makes nasty
painful shit, so I knew going in meant losing myself entirely and being
recreated, but I was terrified that the stuff of my fear would be what the
new self was made out of and I'd be a psycho paranoid.. GIGO.. I forgot
about "unconditional love can find a better way than I could think of"..
and was freaking that a nonjudgmental creator would remake me badly. LOL!!
Sounds funny, now, but in a way I was right. Any doubt of Divine will, in
the months following would give me a flashback of that cold back of the
neck chill fear. Very unpleasant, but I learned quick!
The other trap I had been in, that night, was the presence of thousands
of disapproving ancestors in the room with me: the old information coming
out of my trembling shaky cold&electric bones, of how life must be a hard
struggle.. Goddess provided a friend to come and rescue me, and tell me to
love them and set them free... and when I did that, I felt as if my body
was destroyed and recreated, in an instant.. as the time pathways changed.
The attachment I had clung to, fear of harm, remained.. and the year
following told me how deep it really was. At age 12, as a K-awakened novice
self hypnotist, I had used all of the power I possessed to bind into myself
a law "For the good of all and the harm of none".. and I had made it to be
incontrovertible so long as I lived.. and binding to myself also, without
realizing it, the duality of my Law.. the fear of harm.
Realizing my folly, I asked Goddess to send Death to free me from my
self-created prison.. and spent several very odd months, being courted by
the Reaper, and being guided to create an elaborate ritual of the Marriage
of Persephone to Hades, while my inner child seemed to be starring in some
kind of tearjerker movie about terminal illness.. and my body remained in
radiant health.
Buried in the ritual, was a completion of my Shamanic quest. Some years
before, I had become a Shaman of Chacmool, the Rain God of the Maya.. I had
explained to him on day 1, that ripping the bloody hearts out of folks as
sacrifice doesn't fly, this century.. He reassured me that it wasn't
necessary..Part of the ritual of "marriage", was the gift of my heart to
Him.. as an aspect of death, the light under the ground I had sought in
the plantpot.. :) ..and of my male unconscious. Heart sacrifice, in the
way of the old Mayan Royalty..
What is given up to Goddess, comes back, better.. it awakened the Holy
Grail. Since then, my heartbeat is a pulse/wave of energy that I can feel
physically, like I'd been running, even when at rest.. in every part of my
body, even the ends of my hair.. and in everything I touch. I can fall into
it, in meditation, and it expands till it is the universe making love to
itself. The heartbeats of others synchronize with it, into unity.. and it
is incredibly peaceful and healing.
I have led some of my slave-students thru ego-death and rebirth, and
some, but not all, have attained the Grail. I can only guess that the
others were in some way not yet ready. I am still learning..
Last week, synchronicity took me to an elegant web page that describes
the fractal energy effect of the grail very beautifully, especially with
regard to how it creates a sense of unity with everything. Very interesting
stuff!
http://www.danwinter.com/grail.html
this page has a very kewl animation of the fractal wave form that will
make your K. spin.
http://www.danwinter.com/predictions/grailpg.html
larger view: http://www.danwinter.com/grail1.gif
Blessings..
************
I have experienced the dark night of the soul twice. Both times, it
lasted almost exactly for a month. Both were psychosis. The first
occurred around the same time I became aware of K. My memory of the
events is not as clear as it used to be, and it has been a while thanks to
mind-numbing prescription drugs. I've always wanted someone to ask me
about it though, so here is a brief description. ...
First off, during these episodes, I felt responsible for almost everything
that happened in the world or around me that I heard about. I had to keep
reassuring myself that I had nothing to do with it. Also prominent was
intense all-pervading fear and anxiety. The fear stemmed from alarming
beliefs that appear out of nowhere and were for the most part, wrong
(delusions). Difficulty functioning in society also was a part of it. I
was lucky to get up and eat under these conditions. I once had to take an
exam while under psychosis. I got an 18%. Also, everything that was
sensed became oversignificant in my mind. Everything was a sign that
meant something else. The mind was very cluttered. Many streams of
thought were all coincident, each being complex. I suffered from
"complexification" were simple things were made unnecessarily complex and
probably frightful.
***********
>What exactly do you mean by the term Dark Night of the
>Soul ?
>
>Now, a lot of ppl will probably say,
>oh, if you don't know what a DN is, you probably
>have not experienced it, and that is ok.
I'd like to know that too. I thought the classical DN that the Christian
mystics wrote about was a loss of faith... a period of despair and not
being able to find God... not knowing whether there was a God. But some
people here seem to be talking about something very different... a trip
into the deep unconscious. I've done that, more than once, but I wouldn't
call it a Dark Night of the Soul. It wasn't for me, anyway.
************
Hi All...... will write a
bit how it was for me .. and you will all realise that it is different for
everybody.
Well for me it was a protracted period within deep in the unconscious, which
is dark.
Though I appeared to everyone to look the same - I was becoming aware of
mighty
spirit - which in its unfamiliarity was scary to me. I seemed to be on an
inner
journey within and could not get out till I learned my lessons.
It seems rigid attachment to my ego and body as self was replaced with
learning I am fundamentally spirit in essence. This was scary for ego to go
through for it fears
its power being replaced by spirit awareness. So trials and tribulations and
torments
etc were experienced to teach me how bad is clinging to ego and matter as
self .. to
wean me off rigid attachment (now I can come back to play as all aspects - I
am body too and I love my ego).
It was learning how to let go attachment - it was learning how to let go
duality
polarity (even momentarily can be the Gift) .. It was very arduous and
difficult. Not
an overnight thing.
In this inner dark, God and any comfort cannot be found (though one is
protected
during this holy process but you feel anything but) - as we are trusted
enough by the
Lord to be ready to go it alone .. to find the Light Within the Dark. The
dark is God
too. Resisting it empowers it as real and fearful. It taught me so much and
yes as
Christopher has said taught me all my brainwashing from religion set me up for
separation and attachment to fear of a valid part of the whole which is ALL
God. The
teachings of P'taah and such saved my but - but you are drawn to that which
will
help.
~*~
St. Symeon the New Theologian
'I thank you that you, even when I was sitting in darkness,
revealed
yourself to me.
You enlightened me, you granted me to see the light of your
countenance,
that is unbearable to all.
I remained seated in the middle of the darkness I know, but while I
was
there, surrounded by darkness,
You appeared as light, illuminating me completely from
your
total light.
And I became light in the night, I who was found in the
midst of
darkness.
Neither the darkness extinguished your light
completely,
Nor did the light dissipate the visible
darkness,
But they were together, yet completely separate,
Without confusion, far from each other, surely not
at all
mixed,
Except in the same spot where they filled
everything ...
So I am in darkness.
Yet I am still in the middle of the light.
How can darkness receive within itself a light
And, without being dissipated by the light,
It still remains in the middle of the light?
O awesome wonder which I see doubly,
With my two sets of eyes, of the body and the
soul!'
I would say that there are a few here most likely in their dark night of soul
(transformation). It's psychological awakening to Self as witness and ego as
fear and
spirit as Love (as it seemed to me). In any case learning to let go rigid
attachment
to ego allows one to balance awareness as Self (wholeness).
*********
<< I'd like to know that too. I thought the classical DN that the Christian
mystics wrote about was a loss of faith... a period of despair and not
being able to find God... not knowing whether there was a God. >>
Although I was not Christian these symptoms are exactly what I experienced as
my Dark Night. At the time my Kundalini was awakened I was smoking a lot of
ganja, fancying myself some sort of western saddhu. My mindset was
predominately filled with images of Vedic gods, I was reading a lot about
ayurveda, and mixing psychedelics with practice. The woman I was with
practiced more in a Wiccan tradition and we mixed the whole lot together.
Then, one day, something happened. It's taken me ten years to accept the
experience as Kundalini awakening. These years of denial have been my long
dark night. I've tried to explain the experience in many other ways -- all
failing. Part of my denial came from the crushing blow dealt to my ego. In
truth I was not what I pretended to be. My false self was lost to me. What I
thought was God was lost to me. At the same time the "real" me is much more
than I could ever "fake."
Another part of my denial came from wanting more -- a more continuous
experience, a more powerful experience. Part of me said: "What!? This can't
be 'it'! Look at me! I'm still here! I'm still human!" Really, I should
have said something like: "Perhaps now I can become more human." :-)
My apologies for a rather incoherent account. It is only a few weeks now
that I was called on my denial and have recast these years in this new light.
Life is again an adventure, not an adventure of control and conquest, rather
acceptance and surrender: watching the subtle and profound play of Shakti.
*************
Probably the most concise understanding of the Dark Night that I have read ...
..... don't appologise for your individuality ... don't make it wrong ... or
allow others to make it wrong ...
The Dark Night is, in fact, the stripping away of the 'society personality of
need/approval ... and the false sense of 'God out there' (religious beliefs)
...
and seeing that the 'soul' is merely a thought form projection of 'religious
consciousness with its associated 'identity' ... that thought form which has
been projected on us, which we own ... now has no basis for being ... and dies
..
With it, the false 'heart', the illusion of 'godliness' dissolves into the
beingness of 'god' which is the true heart ... which is the realisation of I
Am
...
**********
Link to Chapter 10: THE DARK NIGHT OF THE SOUL
from the book 'Mysticism' by EVELYN UNDERHILL
http://ccel.wheaton.edu/u/underhill/mysticism/mysticism1.0-THE-6.html
[Note: Now moved to
http://www.ccel.org/u/underhill/mysticism/mysticism1.0-THE-6.html ]
***********
Hello!!
>Goddess once told me: become a flame, then the fire
>will never burn you.>
WOW!! I love this! Thank you!!!
>
) - as we are trusted enough by the
> >Lord to be ready to go it alone .. to find the Light Within the Dark. The
>dark is God
> >too. Resisting it empowers it as real and fearful. >
My DN .. similar to what you are referring to ..came before K awakening, and
through an unusual set of circumstances <G>
I had been raised southern baptist and later started frequenting pentecostal
holly roller churches(another story..lol) and I was pretty much..I hate to
say it..quite judgemental and annoying..lol so now I know that the little
quote..."What you judge you become" is true for me because I readily trashed
New Age as stuff of the devil...ROFL even wrote a paper on it which I kkep
here in my desk as a reminder...anyway..somhow one day I found myself at a
healers house trading a healing treaatment for a perm!(Im was a part time
hairdresser) and OMG it rocked my world. The sensations I felt really
caused me to review and reexamine my whole basis of thought. I started
reading Edgar Cayce and looking into reincarnation...etc etc.. and had to
tear down everything that I had built my life on thus far...scary??? Damn
Straight... Once I cut loose my attachment to the bible as the only literal
truth..I was scared..sh**less :-0 Visions of demons and what now and where
do I go..I had to reconstruct and examine every belief and see if it "felt
"true..I started feeling things in my gut to see how it "felt " to me. I
would have to say that period was my DN. It was liberating but frightening
at the same time and I lost some friends because of it.. Upon K awakening I
knew it had something to do with energy becuase it felt energetic but I
thought I was jsut somehow overenergized and it confused me and was
uncomfortable..but it didnt rock my world the way tearing down my beliefs
did!
ps- heres another of my favorit quotes.....
"What is eternal cannot be seperated form its source"..this one helped me
out alot at that time :-)
*********
http://www.kundalini-gateway.org
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