To: K-list
Recieved: 2001/11/20 10:50
Subject: [K-list] Re: The Bastard
From: Joshua Sutterfield
On 2001/11/20 10:50, Joshua Sutterfield posted thus to the K-list:
I was taking note of comments about original sin in the original post my
subject refers to -- yeah, the idea of original sin is certainly one of
the first things you think about as far as fear-based religious
principles. What has fascinated me lately is recognizing a second
interpretation, or maybe some of the positive origins of it, or some ways
it was turned into a positive.
I have particularly tried to "translate" the principles learned from a
baptist church. I didn't grow up in it exactly but in my teens I was a
"lost sinner" and was involved in the church for a good while. In some
ways it's "just metaphorical" yet metaphor is everything, is the
fundamental organizing principle of our mind, I think. And no doubt it
seeps into all our principles, there is a multiplicity of meanings which
simultaneously survive.
What struck me most, is how quickly and easily the whole set of
baptist/Christian ideas I had stored up as things I was not at peace with
-- how quickly I did come to peace with them. A ton of things right away
point to those churches' purpose as the separating force, the capturing of
salvation (our church involved a distinct "experience" which came after
much praying and repentance, and was no doubt very real, certainly related
to spiritual energies such as K) -- I was saying, the capturing of a
salvation experience followed by naming it and wrapping their
preconceptions about god around it, and deciding it could never be
achieved again, was just some special glimpse of heaven.
What surprises me is how many beliefs seem still intact in my mind, if
only viewed slightly different. Original Sin is a simple enough
statement, but an annoying roadblock for a sort of inverted egotism.
Purely put, it is true (as far as I see it).. each of us is accountable
for what each of us has done, because we are one. God is accountable too,
in each of us. What does that mean though.. do we have to pay, in some
separate event of damnation? By whom? Nobody can damn us, there is only
us -- but we DO pay. We pay right off the bat. Instant Karma. I inflict
suffering, suffering is inflicted. X dispenses harm to Y, Y experiences
harm. God pays for his actions through X with his experiences through
Y. X deludes himself to believe he is separate from Y and thus is
separate from the "paying". Y also deludes himself to believe he was not
the cause of his own suffering. When there is salvation between them, X
loves Y and X and Y become mutually accountable for all joy and pain
between them.
Hmm anyways though, I guess something about mutual accountability is how
I accept original sin.. still at the same time I know I am also accepting
the idea that none of us are accountable, as far as any concern for
retribution goes, because the payment is made. The payment is made in
seeing the unity. This is how I recognize Christ as the fulfillment, or
the payment, and how I come (quite amusedly) to accepting Christ in a
deeper way than most in my church seem to have. Christ represents the
unity of man and God, also the unity of one man with all.. he accepted
the weight of all men's sin, and loved each completely.. in this he
accepted full "payment".
But payment is only focus on one end, also he recieves I think, all the
eternal joy that is held in us.. he knows it is worth it. Anyways, the
truth he represents reaches me so deeply I dont care if he never existed..
I choose to be the fulfillment. I have not realized it, nor do I actively
seek martyrdom or know how to actually "experience" it, but I recognize
the truth. I imagine God has actually incarnated as several different
bodies who happened to fully achieve the truth and expereince it. Maybe
every one of us, upon death.
Anyways, so repentance, well I guess that could be seen as two things, or
both. Either.. feeling the "love of Christ" at your doorstep, which means
not feeling it only coming to you, but coming from you -- and the love of
Christ would be full of pain, pain for all human acts which resulted in
suffering, for all acts done in the illusion of "separation". So the key
to accepting that love would be to feel the pain for even your own acts,
and to thus "die" to that world, "repent" of all things you did under the
illusion of separation from God, accept a new place as a living
manifestation of God, aware of others as more of the same, doing all deeds
in mindfulness of this.
But where the more standardized repentance comes in, as I said there is a
reverse egoism in an obsession about original sin.. even though we hold
all sins of all men in our lap, we hold this as condemnation from god, in
other words we use the unity-derived accountability to deny unity, to put
ourselves down low and fearful and inferior to something great. Indeed
God is greater than us as a unique part, but as long as we are so into
belittling that one part, we are living in that one part, we are not done
repenting, not done dying.. and that part must die. If we insist all our
lives on saying o-god-i-suck, then he's gonna say 'ok ok, enough about
you, praise me, goddammit.' and once you're not in the "part", once
you're really praising, then you're in the whole.
Anyhoo, yeah, just was thinking about how remarkable it is, how my world
looks now, such that these fear-based religions somehow resonate with me,
they dont seem like obstacles or mistakes, they seem like acceptable
manifestations generated beautifully by the Truth, and I can see that they
are simple perversions of a deeper truth, that I can see the deeper truth
is still "encoded" in a very poignant way, such that as I see Christian
churches spewing the skewed fear-tainted truths, I hear the original truth
loud and clear and feel pain for them, for knowing even then, God is so
close to them, so "visible", still carried among them as they carry out
their purpose, the whole church functioning like a lost soul not done
repenting, seeing its "parts" jump up in joyful tears saying "I'm saved"
and swooping down and saying "and this is what it means and this is what
you say and this is what you do" so that the whole would not be saved,
would not explode like the whole of that individual part did.
It reminds me of my girlfriend, having a tremendous breakdown, going
through such a nasty time, hating everything, but every other word she
said was a tremendous, ironic clue, a solution and explanation to her
whole problem.. she was reaching out to herself, she was showing that the
truth was always there, just waiting to be embraced.
Joosh
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