To: K-list
Recieved: 2000/06/27 15:21
Subject: Digest 203, Sunday, June 25, 2000 2:12 AM
From: percyval
On 2000/06/27 15:21, percyval posted thus to the K-list:
Digest 203, Sunday, June 25, 2000 2:12 AM
------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. The Big Day
From: Paul Perner <ravensdawnATnospamearthlink.net>
2. Shaktipat
From: FreyjaDATnospamaol.com
3. Re: Shaktipat
From: "percyval" <percyvalATnospamrcn.com>
4. Re: Abuse Poll
From: druoutATnospamaol.com
5. Re: Shaktipat
From: IGPB Paramajaya <paramaATnospamtelkom.co.id>
6. Re: Tummo Rei Ki
From: IGPB Paramajaya <paramaATnospamtelkom.co.id>
7. Re: Abuse Poll
From: Hbarrett47ATnospamaol.com
8. Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
From: ckressATnospamaol.com
9. Re: The Big Day
From: ckressATnospamaol.com
10. Re: The Big Day
From: GCWein1111ATnospamaol.com
11. Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
From: GCWein1111ATnospamaol.com
12. Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
13. Re:My vote for El
From: GCWein1111ATnospamaol.com
14. Re: Abuse Poll
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
15. Re: Re:My vote for El
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
16. Fwd: Abuse Poll
From: moonshdw999ATnospamaol.com
17. Re: Abuse Poll
From: v <madammumATnospamptialaska.net>
18. Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
From: "percyval" <percyvalATnospamrcn.com>
19. Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
20. Re: Tummo Rei Ki
From: divine_goddessATnospamhotmail.com
21. Re: Abuse Poll
From: divine_goddessATnospamhotmail.com
22. Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
From: divine_goddessATnospamhotmail.com
23. Re: Abuse Poll
From: "huka9802:First huka9802:Last" <huka9802ATnospamearthlink.net>
24. Re: Learned Optimism.
From: "huka9802:First huka9802:Last" <huka9802ATnospamearthlink.net>
25. Fwd: Abuse Poll
From: YahseyesATnospamaol.com
________
________
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:27:34 -0700
From: Paul Perner <ravensdawnATnospamearthlink.net>
Subject: The Big Day
It was almost ten years ago that they broke ground. There was the usual
little
ceremony with the mayor turning over a shovel full of pre loosened dirt
surrounded by inept local politicians, but a week later, the real stuff got
under
way. I remember that morning well.
I woke up to the sound of trucks and heavy earth moving equipment. Stepping
outside I walked down to the main street to see what was going on. Among the
workers was a woman with striking looks. She wore a silver hard hat over her
long
blonde hair and seemed to be the one in charge of the project.
A man with a flag stopped the
traffic.
A kind of silence fell over the
area.
A bell sounded followed by a short wail of a siren. Then the woman, who was
standing about ten feet away from me, with a calm, business like demeanor,
spoke
into her hand radio, "Fire in the hole."..........
BOOM!!! The street jumped beneath my feet and my heart almost jumped out of
my
throat.
And this woman just clips her radio back on to her utility belt and walks
away
like it was nothing. All I could say was, "wow."
She had started blasting for the ten mile subway tunnel that would link
suburban
North Hollywood with Hollywood and downtown LA. But there were no cameras
that
morning and she was no actress. She was a supervisor on an explosives team
and
along with a few tons of rock, she blew away all my old conceptions of
"women's
work."
So now it's June 24th.
Ten miles, ten years, several hundred million dollars, a few political
scandals
and one major earthquake later, the mayor and the cameras are back.
It's the big day.
But mind you this is *North* H-wood, not Tinsel Town proper. We've always
been
in shadow of our larger, well funded neighbors to the south. They see us as
cultureless air heads. I hate to say it, but they're often right. We're in
the
Valley. And we're cursed with a regional surfer like accent (like, bitchen,
dude..... (ack!)). This is the backwater of the media industry. (Even the
major
studios downtown are owned by outside interests. Hollywood is mostly in the
hands
of Canadians now. A little known fact, but true.) This is just an ordinary
district with poor, welfare section 8 housing on one side of Magnolia and
the
middle class mundane on the other. I live in between, right off Magnolia
(the
movie of the same name was quite descriptive of the messed of lives some
people
get into here). Our main international export is special effects post
production,
sound equipment and cheap pornography. The rest of LA sees the North
Hollywood
Arts District, "No Ho," as a desperate experiment: Take a small seed of
culture,
toss it in a sea of white trash and see if it will grow. It almost didn't
take
and years ago, we almost got left out of the plans for the final subway
link.
That was then.
This is now. The tunnel is complete and the trains are on the track. The
mayor
is about hit the on switch and a two day public celebration will soon begin.
The stage is set. But wait!!!
Like the explosives expert, another heroic woman has popped out of nowhere.
She's a little known rock singer (in the band Kelly's Lot) and marathon
runner
who has awakened via several "runner's highs." She's a true live wire who
uses
her energy to organize benefits for the less fortunate in the area. She's
not
into the glamor thing, but can belt out a tune with the best of them. Few
people
know of good she's done for others on a personal level. She's very modest
and
doesn't seen to realize it her self. But when she ran in the LA marathon and
sang
to the other runners to encourage them, she became a roll model for a lot of
folks.
Of the five music stages, she was chosen to host the one that will feature
local
talent. She was also allowed to schedule the performances. It's located
right by
the subway entrance. And I just heard that in the morning on opening day (in
a
few hours) she's planned a public meditation
followed by the "sound of OM and drumming." YES!!!!!!!!! Go Kelly, go!!!
You won't hear this on the news and most of the world may never notice it,
but
let it be known that our subway was began not by politicians and money, but
by a
woman quietly saying, "fire in the hole" with a bundle of dynamite at her
command. And today that same tunnel will be spiritually dedicated through
the
voice and energy of another unassuming, unpretentious woman. It will be the
fire
of love.
Cities rise and fall... they crumble like sand castles in the tide.
But Goddess remains.
In Her, it will always be, "the big day."
Paul
________
________
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 09:07:41 EDT
From: FreyjaDATnospamaol.com
Subject: Shaktipat
Can anyone define Shaktipat for me?
Thanks
Freyja
________
________
Message: 3
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 10:50:21 -0400
From: "percyval" <percyvalATnospamrcn.com>
Subject: Re: Shaktipat
From: <FreyjaDATnospamaol.com>
> Can anyone define Shaktipat for me?
one of the best discussions of shaktipat is in Kurt Keutzer's "Siddha
Mahayoga FAQ":
http://www-cad.eecs.berkeley.edu/~keutzer/kundalini/siddha-mahayoga.html
also, his Kundalini FAQ is great reading and is mirrored on the K-Gateway
website:
http://www.list-server.net/kundalini/kurt/k-faq.html
________
________
Message: 4
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 11:20:32 EDT
From: druoutATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: Abuse Poll
In a message dated 6/23/00 4:24:00 PM Pacific Daylight Time, ckressATnospamaol.com
writes:
<< Both of them were emotionally abusive to each other and
the rest of our family. My mother was physically abusive to me too >>
AND,
In a message dated 6/21/00 4:17:45 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
aurasphereATnospamhome.com writes:
<< During that early experiences of myself being discarded, thrown away
literally, I discovered that the only thing that is the truth is that death
does not exist.... that was my discovery... Also I, the self, was not
affected.. >>
Dear List,
The sensitive issue of Child Abuse has been an undercurrent on this list
over
the years. I believe it to be one of the "triggers" to later awakening.
Question: Were you abused as a child? What form did this abuse take?
How did you deal with this abuse?
Do you think it was the primary reason for your K awakening?
Please feel free to E-mail me privately.
Love, Hillary
________
________
Message: 5
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 22:20:49 +0700
From: IGPB Paramajaya <paramaATnospamtelkom.co.id>
Subject: Re: Shaktipat
Dear Freyja,
Shaktipat means energy transfer. In Kundalini, Shaktipat technique is one
of the technique used to awaken someone's Kundalini. Traditionally, someone
had to do hard effort and practice to have his/her kundalini awakened. Now,
you can have your Kundalini awakened by means of other people help. A guru
or a master does the Kundalini awakening process for you. You just relax
and in pasif or you can say effortless. In my understanding, to be able to
do shaktipat to others, someone has to have certain achievment in his/her
Kundalini progress. We are talking about Kundalini essence here, not the
fire. Note: Kundalini essence is like the blue fire and the Kundalini fire
is the red one, when you light up the lighter. The heat is the energy.
The Kundalini essence should reach at least Heart Chakra to be able to do
sahktipat technique and to be able to create a channel in sushumna (to be
free from Kundalini syndrome) the Kundalini essence should reach Crown
Chakra (known as the union of Shakti and Shiva).
There are many shaktipat technique. You can clasify them based on the
energy channel used and how far is the channel opened. There is a shaktipat
technique that utilise Ida channel or Pinggala channel or directly
sushumna, the main energy channel. IMHO, the best shaktipat technique is
the one that awakened someone Kundalini and fully open the sushumna, from
the Perineum to the Crown Chakra, to guarantee free of Kundalini syndrome.
Once your Sushumna is fully opened, the Ida and Pinggala can be easily
opened. The perfect Kundalini awakening process should go through fully
sushumna opening since all major chakras have their roots in sushumna.
Other classification may based based on kind of energy used to awaken
someone Kundalini.
May this information useful.
L&L,
Rama
At 09:07 24/06/00 EDT, FreyjaDATnospamaol.com wrote:
>Can anyone define Shaktipat for me?
>
>Thanks
>
>Freyja
>
________
________
Message: 6
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 22:26:35 +0700
From: IGPB Paramajaya <paramaATnospamtelkom.co.id>
Subject: Re: Tummo Rei Ki
Dear Freyja,
I can give you a long description about the differences, but I prefer to do
that privately since someone has already warned me not to spam the list with
this kind of information, whether or not it will be useful to other. I have
to follow the guideline anyway.
L&L,
Rama
At 05:39 24/06/00 EDT, FreyjaDATnospamaol.com wrote:
>21st June - paramaATnospamtelkom.co.id (IGPB Paramajaya) wrote:
>
>I know a shaktipat technique that can awaken someone Kundalini directly. I
>have received attunement to "Rei Ki one level", and hope to receive level
two
>in about a month's time; but can you explain how TUMMO REI KI differs from
>any other sort of REIKI?
>
>I had quite a lot of Kundalini activity going on until my attunement and
now
>it all seems to be much calmer. I am able to sleep, and I feel much more
>serene and complete.
>
>Blessings Freyja
________
________
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 12:16:54 EDT
From: Hbarrett47ATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: Abuse Poll
I was not abused but this is a subject that has interested me for a long
time
-- thanks Hillary! I've heard a number of people theorize that survivors of
abuse have an advantage in spiritual attainment because they learn early the
skill of leaving the body. Staying grounded during the abuse would mean
emotional death so they figure out how to leave and, therefore, get glimpses
of other worlds. Holly
________
________
Message: 8
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 13:36:03 EDT
From: ckressATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
In a message dated 06/24/2000 1:20:52 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
aurasphereATnospamhome.com writes:
<< I wrote:
>Is there something wrong with animals too here?>>
Wim, I'm keeping this up because even when I've ignored some of your latest
series of posts, you keep summoning me by name in every one. You just can't
let it go until you're satisfied that I've cried "Uncle!" (i.e., that I
concede that you're my superior), and it ain't gonna happen.
Do you notice that when I parody anyone else but you, you're right there
cheering me on, but when it comes to yourself, your sense of humor falls
off?
I find laughing at myself even more fun than laughing at others. But hardly
anyone wants to play "let's laugh at ourselves." It's serious play, too -- a
greatly underrated discipline for releasing self-importance.
<< The power to stand up for ONESELF makes one *the most powerful*>>
Like most of what you say, I disagree with this statement entirely. Standing
up for oneself is valuable, but it doesn't make anyone "the most powerful"
--nobody is the most powerful -- and I don't think it's the most important
spiritual strength. People with a lot of humility may not stand up for
themselves at all, yet be highly spiritually developed in other ways.
<< That is what I try to say, it is not? "Stand up for yourself, diminish
and
annul the
fear instilling tactics of power mongers and abusers.">>
You spout a lot of self-contradictory stuff, Wim. Your huge beef with me
seems to be that I stand up for myself with you.
<<Let me mention what you write about how your mother was with you:>>
My autobiographical piece was my way of demonstrating how complex the human
psyche is, and how simply advising optimism or any other outlook doesn't
solve everything. We're each a uniquely prismatic mix of all kinds of traits
and shades of black, white and gray.
<<You may not see that, you may be too much in the middle of it,
but.... could it not be that others who have more genuine (not weird) love
for you than you can imagine may be on the right track.>>
Bingo, you hit the nail on the head. Yes, Wim, you're sure that you're on
the "right track," therefore someone like me, who isn't tracking along with
you, must be on the wrong track. However, I'm certain that I am on the
actual right track, and you, my dear, are mostly out to lunch.
Both of us leave fairly large footprints all over the list, so anyone who
has
been here for any length of time has witnessed both of us sing and dance
enough to get the gist of our respective "tracks." You label your track
"Love" and try to claim a patent on it, so you get all bent out of shape
whenever I presume to speak of, or act from, or know diddly squat about
Love.
Any observations I make about love, and my expression of love for myself or
anyone else, doesn't fit the Wim-specified-model. So to you this means I'm
dead wrong, thus must receive more of your instruction on how to love, who
to
love, when and where to love, with copious redefinitions of love from the
exclusive Wim-dictionary. And surely everyone on list by me can see that you
are the perfect authority on Love. (But really, they can all see that I'm
the ultimate Love authority, and you're an impostor.)
Shall we take a poll? How many people think that Wim is flaming Love on
wheels? How many people KNOW that I am Love's genuine appointed
representative? How many think both of us are full of it and wish we would
shut up? How many couldn't care less? And here's the trick question: How
many prefer not to get involved and decline to vote in this poll?
OK, Wim, let's see what the audience decides. And we're both hams for the
audience, aren't we? Otherwise, we would be conducting our never-ending
debate off list.
Still standing (in a truly outstanding way),
El
________
________
Message: 9
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 14:44:26 EDT
From: ckressATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: The Big Day
In a message dated 06/24/2000 4:33:37 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
ravensdawnATnospamearthlink.net writes:
<< Cities rise and fall... they crumble like sand castles in the tide.
But Goddess remains.
In Her, it will always be, "the big day."
>>
Paul, again I am floored by your incredibly gifted, soulful, straight-from
the -heart, breezy revelatory posts! Bravo! And more, more...
Love,
El
________
________
Message: 10
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 16:37:54 EDT
From: GCWein1111ATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: The Big Day
In a message dated 6/24/00 4:33:42 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
ravensdawnATnospamearthlink.net writes:
<< The rest of LA sees the North Hollywood
Arts District, "No Ho," as a desperate experiment: Take a small seed of
culture,
toss it in a sea of white trash and see if it will grow. It almost didn't
take
and years ago, we almost got left out of the plans for the final subway
link.
>>
l thoroughly enjoyed this, Paul. What kind of work do you do out there,
write screen-plays? lf not, they could use you. (So could Al Gore, BTW ...
hey, did l detect a bit of James Carville with that white trash line? You
didn't get a picture of that blond did you? .....)
jerrysan
________
________
Message: 11
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 17:30:59 EDT
From: GCWein1111ATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
In a message dated 6/24/00 10:37:25 AM Pacific Daylight Time, ckressATnospamaol.com
writes:
<< Shall we take a poll? How many people think that Wim is flaming Love on
wheels? How many people KNOW that I am Love's genuine appointed
representative? How many think both of us are full of it and wish we would
shut up? How many couldn't care less? And here's the trick question: How
many prefer not to get involved and decline to vote in this poll?
>>
Well, l think you're both full of it, but El, you are the unquestioned
"full of it" master whose creativity and wit are without peer and never get
old, so you can keep talking. You, William, can shut up. :)
jerrysan
________
________
Message: 12
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 14:31:15 -0700
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
Subject: Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
Dear El,
You wrote:
> Shall we take a poll? How many people think that Wim is flaming Love on
> wheels? How many people KNOW that I am Love's genuine appointed
> representative? How many think both of us are full of it and wish we
would
> shut up? How many couldn't care less? And here's the trick question: How
> many prefer not to get involved and decline to vote in this poll?
>
> OK, Wim, let's see what the audience decides. And we're both hams for the
> audience, aren't we? Otherwise, we would be conducting our never-ending
> debate off list.
Did it come to this?
You or me... ?
Do you take it so personally?
The ultimate peer test?
Was this ever the intention... of course not?
It is about loving one another, not a popularity contest.
Also, no I do not think we are hams (another pejorative animal symbolism
:-), I think it is OK to have our discussion on-list. I think important
issues are being dealt with. Ad nauseam, I guess, but that may be a quality
of our lives that we like to continue, it appears.
If we have to play the fools, even be the the fools... I'm alright with
that. As long as it has nothing to do with winning or losing... as long as
it is all about love and the various insights we may gain by discussing our
difficulties in surrendering to it
Love, Wim
PS. I'll be on my way to Holland tonight, my father is passing on, my mother
just phoned me saying that he probably will not take too long...
________
________
Message: 13
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 17:37:40 EDT
From: GCWein1111ATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re:My vote for El
<< Well, l think you're both full of it, but El, you are the
unquestioned "full of it" master whose creativity and wit are without peer
and never get old, so you can keep talking. You, William, can shut up. :)
jerrysan >>
BTW, l forgot to mention that because of my status as an eminent zen
master my vote equals 10 of anyone else's, so William, you're behind 10 to
0.
Sorry.
________
________
Message: 14
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 14:42:16 -0700
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
Subject: Re: Abuse Poll
Dear Hillary
> The sensitive issue of Child Abuse has been an undercurrent on this list
over
> the years. I believe it to be one of the "triggers" to later awakening.
I think so too!
> Question: Were you abused as a child? What form did this abuse take?
Yes, beatings, sexual abuse.
> How did you deal with this abuse?
Repressing it, and subconsciously passing it on to others... (attempting to
do to others what was done to me) The sexual abuse almost, luckily it could
stop at the platonic form, was soooo close though, thank God for the help I
got. The beating, just one time beat my son and that scared the hell out of
me... Got me to start transforming myself...
> Do you think it was the primary reason for your K awakening?
Yes!
Love,
Wim
________
________
Message: 15
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 15:34:45 -0700
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
Subject: Re: Re:My vote for El
Dear Jerry
You wrote:
> You, William, can shut up. :)
>
> jerrysan >>
>
> BTW, l forgot to mention that because of my status as an eminent zen
> master my vote equals 10 of anyone else's, so William, you're behind 10 to
0.
> Sorry.
To be beaten that way..., by a real zen man...wow (:-)
10 to 1 it was one hand slapping :-)
The other one was needed for typing I guess
Love,
Wim
________
________
Message: 16
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 18:44:41 EDT
From: moonshdw999ATnospamaol.com
Subject: Fwd: Abuse Poll
In a message dated 6/24/00 8:21:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time, druoutATnospamaol.com
writes:
Hi Hillary :).
> Question: Were you abused as a child? What form did this abuse take?
I was physically, emotionally, and sexually abused and rejected as a child..
How did you deal with the abuse?
I stopped feeling and seeing. I shut down completely.
Do you think it was the primary reason for your K awakening?
Yes, it was awaken or leave my body. I chose to awaken.
________
________
Message: 17
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 15:27:34 -0800
From: v <madammumATnospamptialaska.net>
Subject: Re: Abuse Poll
I was severely abused as a child; first I was abandoned by my REAL
father, whom I adored, & he made plans with me over & over & over, &
would not show up, or even call. He preferred getting drunk with his
buddies, over me.
My mother had been involved in a fledgling career as a jazz singer,
& I had not been part of her plan. She took me all over to the back
rooms of bars, so she could party out front, & also to jazz rehearsals
at people's houses, where they all did LOTS more stuff besides play
music & drink. Jim Pepper was a saxophonist about 14 or so then, so it
was his job to babysit me. I dunno if anybody's even heard of him; he
had one big hit, 'WichiTaiToe', & he has since died of dilapitation &
drug abuse in Amsterdam.
My father had my mother committed; she was leaving me with these
horrible "babysitters", for weeks on end. They used to beat me with
thorny sticks - well - it was the husband who did that - or no reasons
whatsoever.
I dunno how my mom pulled it off, but she had an eligible & wealthy
UPI photojournalist pick her up from Dammasch Hospital (of 'One Flew
Over the Cuckoo's Nest' fame), & they picked me up from my dad's new
"family". My dad's new wife had despised me, & her 3 daughters from
another marriage were always favored. I would tell my dad she was lying
so she could lock me up in a room by myself for days, after beating me
for sh*t she would make up out of her head, & when my dad came home he
would also beat me. He never believed me, he believed her.
After a long string of Catholic schools in 4 different states, when I
became of puberty, he threw out my mom (who was strung out on speed &
really WAS an edgey bitch), & began sexually abusing me. I was put in
the place to be mother to my 2 little sisters, very young then, & I was
only 13 & 14. Sexual abuse every night, beatings & almost killing me by
day, making me pose nude for him, my little sisters were thrown out of a
school for "emotionally disturbed children" for being incorrigible, & I
was the one who had to deal with them. It's no wonder I haven't got a
clue how to handle my own daughter Amelia, who is even more pig-headed
than my little sisters were together.
I had to leave home at age 14 & was placed in a string of temporary
foster homes. My mother was the one who drove down from Portland &
signed me over to 'Catholic Social Services'.
Unfortunately for her, they could not place me in any permanent
situation, because there were none, so I had to go north to be with her
because they had no more temporary foster homes left.
The night I arrived she forgot about me & let me sit in the rain on
her porch because she was out drinking with her friends. Her male
roommate came home first, from driving cab, & he was blasted & tried to
seduce me.
Anyway, that's only the half of it.
Yes, it did drive me to yoga & meditation, only I had blocked out my
whole childhood & including my 20's & '30's, & have only recently. the
past couple years, have begun to remember. All that crap which was
*stuffed* for survival's sake has begun the process of pain & torture
that I had no time for, until recently. Every little trigger - I cannot
even be in love with anyone because I am overwhelmed with the emotional
pain I need to go thru & purge. Sometimes all it takes is a smile...
Even right now, it is a GORGEOUS sunny day here. Everyone is out
enjoying the sun. I did my radio show & could go out to a beach, but I
won't let myself. I can't be around people because I can't trust that
they wouldn't totally freak me out. And when I began this post I was
crying about it. Because I really want to go out & have fun deep inside,
but won't let myself. I guess it's the *adult* & *inner child*relations.
My *adult* tortures me by the reclusiveness & total isolation from
people. Even when I want to mingle, it's totallyt theatre arts any joy
I might glean.
Writing this has helped relieve the tension of abandonment &
isolation.
Thankyou all, & God/ess bless the internet!
;-)
valerie
> Dear List,
>
> The sensitive issue of Child Abuse has been an undercurrent on this list
over
> the years. I believe it to be one of the "triggers" to later awakening.
>
> Question: Were you abused as a child? What form did this abuse take?
>
> How did you deal with this abuse?
>
> Do you think it was the primary reason for your K awakening?
>
> Please feel free to E-mail me privately.
>
> Love, Hillary
________
________
Message: 18
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 19:29:47 -0400
From: "percyval" <percyvalATnospamrcn.com>
Subject: Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
From: <ckressATnospamaol.com>
> Shall we take a poll? How many people think that Wim is flaming Love on
> wheels? How many people KNOW that I am Love's genuine appointed
> representative? How many think both of us are full of it and wish we
would
> shut up? How many couldn't care less? And here's the trick question: How
> many prefer not to get involved and decline to vote in this poll?
>
> OK, Wim, let's see what the audience decides. And we're both hams for the
> audience, aren't we? Otherwise, we would be conducting our never-ending
> debate off list.
hey youse guys!
this is great! i vote for you to continue this lovefest in public on the
list... please make sure to also listen to what each other is really
saying... you both are amazing people, and quite wise...
lovingly,
percyval
________
________
Message: 19
Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 18:10:13 -0700
From: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>
Subject: Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
Dear Percyval
You wrote:
> hey youse guys!
>
> this is great! i vote for you to continue this lovefest in public on the
> list... please make sure to also listen to what each other is really
> saying... you both are amazing people, and quite wise...
>
That is what this is about,
> please make sure to also listen to what each other is really
> saying
I am getting this point, thanks Percyval
Love,
Wim
PS. I just organized all the ferry, plane, jet and bus connections to
hopefully make it to my dad in time.
And if not, there is eternity...and he knows that already... It would just
be so good to hold his hand... and say: "See you again later... in some
other realm of reality."
It might of course be that will stick around, again... that happened
before... Then I was not able to see him...
________
________
Message: 20
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 02:58:35 -0000
From: divine_goddessATnospamhotmail.com
Subject: Re: Tummo Rei Ki
Hi Rama,
I don't think a discussion about different shakitpat techniques is
spam. Advertising is another thing. I would like to hear about it.
Blessings,
Susan
--- In Kundalini-GatewayATnospamegroups.com, IGPB Paramajaya <paramaATnospamt...>
wrote:
> Dear Freyja,
>
> I can give you a long description about the differences, but I
prefer to do
> that privately since someone has already warned me not to spam the
list with
> this kind of information, whether or not it will be useful to
other. I have
> to follow the guideline anyway.
>
> L&L,
> Rama
>
________
________
Message: 21
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 03:12:59 -0000
From: divine_goddessATnospamhotmail.com
Subject: Re: Abuse Poll
>
> Question: Were you abused as a child? What form did this abuse
take?
i was emotionally and physically abused by the man my mother married
from the age of 11 to 18. I was also spiritually and psychically
tortured by demonic oppression from 12 to early 20s; also include
sexual molestation by dark entities. I believed I was insane
and at times was suicidal.
>
> How did you deal with this abuse?
I discovered the Witness State. I could dispassionately remove myself
from the abuse and become the objective observer. I learned I was
more than my body or my experiences. Fortunately, I did not
fractionate into multiple personalities. If I had not found the
Witness State I think I would have. I learned to travel to other
dimensions with my spirit.
>
> Do you think it was the primary reason for your K awakening?
Don't think so...it certainly drove me inside myself. I received
Shakitpat almost 15 years later.
Susan
>
> Please feel free to E-mail me privately.
>
> Love, Hillary
________
________
Message: 22
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 03:21:10 -0000
From: divine_goddessATnospamhotmail.com
Subject: Re: critters, hounds, pigs, asses.
Honestly, I love you both, but I am getting a headache keeping up
with you two. It feels like both of you are hiding behind your flair
for language rather than the speaking from your hearts anymore.
Why do i feel that? well, first of all the headache, second of all
the words have lost their juiciness. I can't see the words any more
and what I feel is the stale mate of old family arguments.
Love,
Susan
________
________
Message: 23
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:40:04 -0500
From: "huka9802:First huka9802:Last" <huka9802ATnospamearthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Abuse Poll
> > Question: Were you abused as a child? What form did this abuse take?
>
> I was physically, emotionally, and sexually abused as a child by an older
brother and neglected by my parents.
>
> How did you deal with the abuse?
>
> I minimized it; it was no big deal. I didn't really even know it wasn't
okay for people to treat me that way. Once when my brother was beating me
up in the living room, my mother was in the kitchen. Afterward, I went in
and asked her why she didn't do anything. She said I had to be tough. So I
always thought the problem was that I wasn't tough enough; I still do. I
still have trouble just allowing myself to feel my feelings; instead I try
to be "tough". plggh!
> Do you think it was the primary reason for your K awakening?
I don't know, but I really hate this question. I would rather have had a
happier childhood and be a shallow but happy person than to have gone
through that. I think there are better ways or reasons for a K awakening,
like having mentors, etc. My daughter is totally into pop culture (N Sync,
Backstreet Boys, Indigo Girls, etc.) and paints her nails 3 or 4 times a
week, and I just watch her and am glad. She is also spiritual; the other
night we made prayer ties, and we plan to do some other things and she can
have a quite in-depth conversation. She doesn't like church and neither do
I, but I used to think I should take her. Now I think maybe it's better
this way because she knows she is spiritual and prays, etc. without having
to conform to someone else's ideas. If she wants to attend some kind of
ceremony later with other people that's fine. If I find something around
here that seems to fit and she likes I would do that, but for now we do our
own thing at home.
To actually answer the question, it seems to me like when no one is there
for you, you learn to find the resources within and/or develop more of a
connection to the spiritual world, because the physical world isn't meeting
your needs. I knew a woman who was even more neglected than I was; my
parents were there somewhat. This woman's spiritual connection seemed much
clearer and stronger, to the point of hearing voices, etc. At this point, I
am started to feel clearer and more connected.
In other ways, many ways, I feel like the abuse cut me off from my essence
and I severely limited my experiences because of fear. What I knew what
pretty scary, so maybe what I didn't know would be even worse, so I have
stuck pretty close to home in geography or social life. Only recently, I am
starting to try flutterin my wings a little. It's pretty scary sometimes,
but other times it's wonderful.
Blessings,
Karen
Message: 24
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:57:31 -0500
From: "huka9802:First huka9802:Last" <huka9802ATnospamearthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Learned Optimism.
Paul wrote:
> What can I say? There doesn't seem to be an optimism pill on the market.
> The article is titled Learned Optimism. Most of us on this list haven't
> "learned" optimism, we've *earned* it by going through some heavy life
changes
> and/or a psychic, spiritual vortex.
Thank you! I like that! The "Learning" theories just never sit well with
me; they sound too intellectual, and I can never do it. I am a big believer
in "experiential" learning, but that might not be expressing it well either.
It just doesn't seem so neat and tidy and easy as the Learning theory always
seem to make it sound. I find it very difficult to change, and try as I
might I can't make a change I desire. Then I give up, and a year (or two,
or three....) later one day I notice that something has changed, and I'm not
sure how it happened. It seems much more mysterious, even when I've read
all of the theories.
Love,
Karen
_________________
Message: 25
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 02:12:40 EDT
From: YahseyesATnospamaol.com
Subject: Fwd: Abuse Poll
Wow, I sent this to Hillary earlier and decided to make it public after
seeing the beautiful sharing of the experiences of my kindred here. we are
all linked. Its a wonderful feeling to let go and to be with you all and add
to the honor of your experiences and your stories with mine. Here it is...
Love Lou
________
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