Recieved: 2000/03/15 14:18
Subject: [K-list] [El] El apologizes for incendiary post
From: Christopher Wynter
On 2000/03/15 14:18, Christopher Wynter posted thus to the K-list:
From: Christopher Wynter <wynterATnospamone.net.au>
Hello El ....
I would ask you to bear with me as I work through some of the points you wrote
in this post ... and yes, I do understand what you were saying in your
I accept your apology, although no offence was taken on my part ....
At 12:37 AM 16/03/00, you wrote:
>Sorry. A direct Saturn transit opposing my Mercury is probably no excuse to
>anyone but astrologers on list. Truth is, I actually AGREE with one point
>Christopher seemed to be making -- that trying to create certain conditions
>polarizes us against the opposite conditions and thus keeps us spiritually
>fragmented. It was the WAY in which he said it that triggered my psychotic
Not psychotic in my perception, but an outpouring of truth from one who,
as Wlm observed, has had a throat chakra shut down and suddenly opened ...
an immediate reaction .. an expression of something long repressed ...
Such is the nature of the way I write (and speak in my groups) ...
to trigger such openings to what has been long suppressed ... if it wasn't
buried in there, it wouldn't need to come out.
>Also, I've never met anyone whose illness was the result of relentless
>positive thinking -- or relentless fear of disease, for that matter.
In a lot of my work with MPD, BPD, ADD, ADD(h), I have traced the sources
of a lot of these conditions to a systematic mental conditioning of the young
child ... to the point where the child is forced to deny its own knowing,
its own beingness to the degree that it fears any of the "symptoms" of anything
that does not fit into "the mould prescribed" by the parents and the church ...
Similar patterns also arise in my studies of schizophrenia and Alzheimers
I will say here, however, that it is not the parents fault .. because I
this pattern goes deeper .. and the first place to look is the maternal
in most (but all cases). What is manifesting appears to be the result a
indoctrination over generations ... leading to a pre-existing condition
DNA which is triggered by the environmental conditions for the child,
particularly during the first 9 months in utero, a pattern usually reinforced
by the first two then seven years of life.
This pattern is repeated from seven years to puberty, puberty to 28 years,
28 to 42 years ... and so on... as you have observed, the saturn return plays
a part here .. and the "influences" or gift of Saturn is that these patterns
can be used to work backwards to find the source of disease.
>If things worked that simply, there wouldn't be any hypochondriacs because
>fear of having illnesses would materialize as those very illnesses.
I have indeed found this to be the case as I work back through the lives of
older people .... and I have also found that the hypochondriac is actually
expressing someone else's (often mother's) (often unexpressed) fear ...
This information comes from being able to work with many generations of
family groups ...
>Being sick so much, I get fed up with people throwing out armchair judgments
>about what makes people sick, especially if there is strong implication that
>physical illness is the result of being personally or spiritually screwed up.
> I was extremely healthy for the first 43 years of my life, and I wasn't
>blocked or less/more of anything then than I am now.
Ok .. based on the above ... would you like to have a look at the following
for the source .. and the pattern ... 29 years, about 15 years, about 7.5
about 6 months ... and about 8 weeks in utero (when mother first found
out she was pregnant with you ...)
If your mother was between 27 and 29 when you were conceived, then it is
highly probable these patterns have come from her mother or before that even ..
>The only real
>difference is that now I'm more experienced from both ends of the spectrum.
>Does that make me more or less whole than someone who has experienced little
>illness in their life? I don't see what good comes of these comparisons.
>I'm just a human being bumbling along like everyone else, except right now
>I'm bumbling in a more rabid sort of way.
>Harsha recently complimented me on my tolerance of others. Hahahahaha.
>Amazing how fast constant pain and very little sleep can fling tolerance out
>the window. Grrrr grrrr bah humbug. Sorry I jumped all over you, Chris.
>Just me venting. Not your fault.
Perhaps what I have written here may cause something more to "click"
into place ...
another source of repressed memory that can be triggered into coming out
in these "psychotic" syndromes, for both male and female, is the role that
the male played in the relationship .. not only with the child, but the
model seen in the mother-father relationship....
again, it is murky water here because I have found that it is not necessarily
your own male-female model ... but it can, and often does go back
with each succeeding generation deepening the rut
and making the physical body not a safe place to be .. or thing to "own"
as part of you .... and thus often subjected to "abuse" by the mind in
subtle and not so subtle ways ... as not a safe place to be.
This does not only apply to female .. but I have seen the same pattern
arise within males as well ... it's just that I have found that it has been
(particularly in the past) for males to be opened up to talk about
their childhood experiences.
The other thing you need to be aware, is that a child is particularly open
and often "takes on" the thoughts, feelings, emotions ... and particularly
the nightmares of those with whom it sleeps ...
and old furniture carries the thoughtforms of previous generations ...
and a sensitive child sees these ...
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