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To: K-list
Recieved: 2000/01/15 04:32
Subject: Digest for kundaliniATnospamtopica.com, issue 28
From: Kundalini

On 2000/01/15 04:32, Kundalini posted thus to the K-list:

-- Topica Digest --

Re: Really wondering
By LaurelSpringATnospamaol.com

Re: Re kundalini,is it this, chakras,mudrasetc
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net

Re: Really wondering
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net

Re: Really wondering
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net

Re: Really wondering
By robert_weilATnospamscientia.com

Re: did everyone get this post of Amanda's?
By kungajigmeATnospamaol.com

Fwd: Please forward to list: Throat Chakra
By serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com

Interesting Perspective
By ckressATnospamaol.com

Fwd: Re: TOPICA Feedback Form (KMM509361C0KM)
By serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com

Re: Interesting Perspective
By anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net

Hope this question is all right`
By christ_yogiATnospamhotmail.com

Re: Crucifixion-Resurrection Initiation
By magneagaATnospammonet.no

Re: Opinions please? (reply in plain text)
By martinATnospamtucana.demon.co.uk


Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:56:02 EST
From: LaurelSpringATnospamaol.com
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering

Yes! I know what you mean here...its really hard...hard to care and
hurt..much easier to be superficial and non challant. I have heard this
referred to once as "the sacred wound" I believe.. which is an open heart
that is vulnerable. Yet I think of sweet characters like Pooh and children
and puppies and there is absolutely nothing so irresistable and lovable than
an open heart. It is quite I think the most endearing thing there is and
people in general are overwhelmed by this quality. But it is hard to feel
this way all the time and I cry alot.

<< becasue aparantly
 my heart chakra is wide open, I seem to go around with it so open,
 exposed, sensitive, so very full of soft, loving feelings, and when
 someone is hurtful toward me, it just hits like a terrible stringing
 dart. I guess soft is the word, I feel so very soft inside now. >>

Thank you for sharing!


Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 00:24:22 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Re kundalini,is it this, chakras,mudrasetc

Marion Hanvey wrote:
> Dear Jenell,
> Just means you were born psychic Jenell. Everybody's potentially psychic,
> but it's like being able to sing, some can just naturally do it better.
> (I have a terrible voice) The incident when you were a baby may have
> kick-started it, but my guess is that you were born a natural psychic.
> Can you remember anything of psychic significance before your accident
> as a baby?

(J) Well, sort of, at least I THINK so. Consider that the drwoning
incident occurred when I was only 1 1/2 yrs old. But I had always had a
strange memory that I had been unable to 'place', as to when/where it
was. It didn't seem to have much significance, just a fragment of a
memory. But some things coming together makes me think it was more than
that. in it, I was laying on my back, looking up at a blue sky, clouds
drifting by, through the eaves of a tree with large leaves, that I could
remember well enough to recongize them as being Cottonwood or sycamore.
I had a sense of there being some kind of a low white wall surrounding
me, I could only see that wall beside me when I turned my head sideways,
could just look upward, into the leaves of the tree, and at the sky. I
had a sense of being very relaxed and contented. Then, there were
impressions of a great deal of pain, burning pain, through out my chest
and throat, and being unable to breath, feeling suffocated, panic, and
then, I could remember no more about it.

Then, a few years ago, I learned of an incident that others told me of,
that happened when I was only about 6 mos old, that many elements seem
to 'fit'. I had been placed under the shade of a tree, in a bassinet,
one of those old fashioned white wicker ones. It was a hot day, so I was
wearing only a diaper, no shirt. My Motherhad heard me screaming, came
over to find that a little worm called a 'wood asp' had fallen out of
the tree onto me. This is a little worm that looks like it's covered
with soft, woolly fuzz, but that fuzz is actually many tiny poison
tipped spines. It had landed on my chest, I had of course in my
thrashing, been stung in many places, it had rolled down beside my neck,
etc. I had an allergic reaction, had to be taken to a hospital
emergency, where I had been treated, including having to be given
oxygen, becasue the reaction, redness and swelling, was occuring inside
my body as well as outside, in my lungs. I had a later encounter with
one of these things when I was in the fifth grade, and even that one,
that touched me in only one place, made me very ill.

Now, more recently, while in a deep rayer state in a church, I had a
'vision', of the one I recongze as my guide, and consider to be Jesus,
standing above and in front of me, and I was not only seeing him, but
experiening soething of an emotional interchange with him, though there
were no words, He was smiled down at me, almost laughing, as if
something was amusing, I found myself responding back, almost laughing
out loud, just a wonderful, precious moment of sharing love between us.
As I was leaving the church, there was a baby, 6 mos old, that I
stopped to lean over and interact with, I bent over him, we were doing
the usual smiling and laughing at each other, until his mother had to
get him to leave. I learned her name is 'Mercy'. As I straightened up,
you know how sometimes when you do that to fast, your head gets kind of
swimmy for a minute? It did that, but also, had another brief 'flash' of
that I had been expereincing a few minutes earlier, of him looking down
on me, like that, and realized that the way He had been looking at me,
and we had been interactng, was just like I had been doing with the
baby. And without knowing quite why, i suddenly 'knew' that the earlier
'vision' had been a memory of him doing that, and that it had been when
I had been, like this baby, a baby myself, and as I wondered on that,
driving home, I began to see quite clearly in my mind, Him being over me
like that during that incident. That this baby's Mother was 'Mercy', by
the way, is significant, for that is part of the 'name' He has given me
by spirit, 'told' me is mine. That name is 'Daughter of Light, child
born of Mercy'.
 The stepping aside mentally and someone else taking over is a
> mediumistic ability. Did it feel like this person was inside your head sort
> of sharing your mind-space with you?

Yes. thisnhas become a common experince for me. I feel that way a lot.
that there is 'someone else' 'with' me.

 If so, it sounds like you were
> overshadowed, in an altered state of consciousness, and halfway to trance,
> which is physical mediumship. It doesn't mean possession, nobody can be
> possessed, it just means this person blended their energy body with your
> energy body very closely.

Yes, I know what you mean. Yes, that is as it is, it feels like a
'companionship', is the best way to put it. Once only occasionally, now
pretty much all the time, I feel 'aware' of that 'toher presence'. He
doesn't 'take control' of me, 'make' me do anything against my will,
He's just there, a comfortable companion, I can ask advice, He answers,
I can turn myself over to Him to varying degrees as situations warrant
it, for him to 'walk me through', etc.

> As to the unsuitable men, your knowing they were wrong for you, was your
> intuition, your psychic ability again, and you ignoring it, was you ignoring
> your natural ability. I bet while you were saying "yes
> yes", something inside was screaming "no no"!

Very much so. and yet, it would be as if i was being 'overwhelmed',
compelled, to go against my own thought, my own will. I realize now that
this was, and is still a danger to me, through my empathy/telepathy. It
was THEIR strong will, feelings, desires, actually working on me,
psychically. I have been having to learn to recognize that and handle
it, now I'm consciously aware of it. I first realized this, became aware
of it, shortly after my opening, I was having some real problems with a
man i was in casual but regular contact with, being out of linem, not by
making advances, but being pucshy, trying to be manipulative,
controlling, over me. Turned out he had consciously realized he seemed
to have some kind of 'control' over me, supernatural control, that he
thought was HIS 'power', that god had given him 'power' over me for some
reason. he had learend that by using mental imaging during the time I
would be getting dressed to come to church where he would see me, he
could visualize me wearing one of the different outfits he'd seen me
wear before, visualize me wearing those he liked best, and sure enough,
when i got there, I'd be wearing that. I realized how I had been feleing
'guided' in choosing my clothes, and that it had been him influencing
me. that scared the bejabbers out of me, because if he could be doing
that, what else could he, or others do to influence me without my even
knowing it? That was when I first started realizing this, and now have
to be conscious of it at all times when I feel any kind of emotional
interaction with others. I am literaly vulnerable to 'mind control' by
others that have strong feelings about influencing me, my will.

> I don't believe everybody is born with mediumistic abilities, that's beyond
> just psychic.

I've wondered about that. It's a complex thing, at first i thought it
was all the same thing, bt now realize the mediumship is separate and
different. I am far more 'mediumistic' than 'psychic', actually. Most of
my 'psychic' things are actually given to me through medium
> Your receiving inspirational writing etc. is mental mediumship, which is not
> so personally startling to the person on the receiving end of it.

That was odd to even me, that it just seemed so natural, so ordinary,
while I was in a sense of wonderment at it, it never struck me as
startling, or frighten me. Even more recently, being 'aware' of 'other
entities', some of them not nice ones, and communications from dead
people, while it surprised me, I have been amazed at myself for that it
has just felt natural, not strange or odd at all. One thing from the
start, though, that seems different in me than what i read/hear from
otyer mediums, is that I have felt, do feel, and it's just how I
respond, that I do not INITIATE or seek to initiate contact with any
entity, spiritual being, except my own 'guide'. The contacts with
deceased have come spontaenously, have all been polite and pleasant,
usually some minor request to convey to their loved ones, a symbolic act
to do that their loved ones will recongize is from them, etc. I
sensethat as long as i dont try to initiate the contacts, I'm leaning it
to my guide on that side to 'screen' 'who' gets through to me. And that
if i were to try to initiate contacts myself, i'd be subjecting myself
to risk of encounting those i would rather not, to unpleasant, even
dangerous contacts. This is an aspect of this that I'm sharing here,
but few around me know of it, the contacts from the dead, becasue so
many would want me to try to contact someone of theirs, and don't
understand why I won't attempt to do that. It is, for me, a very minor
part of my mediumship abilities and interactions. Most are will my
spirit guide, and/or a couple of others that i consider 'part time'
guides that He has now introduced to me. they are there for specific
situations. Specialists, you might say. One, I love him, he's never
anything but kind and caring of me, is a fearsome one toward any that
would hurt me or endanger me.

  There's a
> more detatched feeling to it, isn't there?

sort of. Like sort of being partly here, partly there?

> So it sounds like k was running from birth, but you repressed it in your
> early years.
> Being very sensitive to others emotions and thoughts is a psychic ability,
> the downside is it's not always very comfortable.

that's an understatement. It's m greatest burden, the 'empathy' of
others' feelings, physical and emotional.

  You cannot be hard and be
> psychic.


> thanks. you, know, after so many years unable to even mention things like this to anyone, it is good just to be able to talk about them, share them, with others that don't think it's weird or evil or mental illness!
Love, Jenell


Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 08:14:47 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering

Robert Weil wrote:
> >Might be a storm in a teacup, does this make any sense to anyone out
> there? Or shall I book my rest cure in the nice white hotel?
> >
> >Rob
> >
> >Yes, a LOT. I too have been undergoing some major 'letting go'' very similar to this you speak of, both of some individuals, and whole groups of them, whole 'social sets', you might say. This for exactly the same reason, I have just gone (grown?) too far beyond them (and I don't mean that to so8nd 'better than'), they simply cannot 'see' what I see, they still walk under the veil of the darkness, that can only feel toward me either hostility, or pity, for their thinking I'm crazy or something. I do not have hostile feelings toward them, only sorrow, and am having to let go of frustrations of realizing I can never ''change' them, for they simply are not yet ready for that, to awaken. I have to leave that in god's hands, to deal with them when and as He will, as to awakening to truth. but relationship with them has become simply unsustainable, and a source of nothing but unpleasant ness on both parts.
> >
> >All truth toboggans into know
> >And trudges up to ignorance again
> >
> >e e cummings
> Unsubscribe from this list by sending email to:
> kundalini-unsubscribeATnospamtopica.com
> _____________________________
> Check out the new and improved Topica site!
> http://www.topica.com/t/13


Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 08:29:54 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering

LaurelSpringATnospamaol.com wrote:
> I have heard this
> referred to once as "the sacred wound" I believe.. which is an open heart
> that is vulnerable.

Yes, I now realize THIS was what the wounded side of Jesus on the cross
meant. It ties into, realtes, to what Magne here has given about the

  Yet I think of sweet characters like Pooh and children
> and puppies and there is absolutely nothing so irresistable and lovable than
> an open heart. It is quite I think the most endearing thing there is and
> people in general are overwhelmed by this quality.

Most all eople can respond to that sweetness in those becasue it is
presented in a non threatening way. It can be hard to understand why
people like this are threatening to some, but we are. I have known all
my life people resojd to me in extremes. I simply don't get enutral
ractions from others. They either love me, and love me very much, or
they hate me, and hate me very much. those that feel threatened have
closed off their own hearts, yet suffer the pain of that, but have so
much fear of letting themselves 'feel', that one that is open terrifies

 But it is hard to feel
> this way all the time and I cry alot.

I understand. but in the crying, we release it, so it's better when we
cry, instead of trying to hold it in. but that too, is very threatening
to some others. Those that 'can't stand' to see others cry, that react
negatively to it, do so becasue it is tugging at their own hearts,
trying to make them feel, and they are afraid of that.



Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 16:38:20 +0000
From: Robert Weil <Robert_WeilATnospamScientia.com>
Subject: Re: [K-list] Really wondering

At 08:14 14/01/00 -0600, you wrote:
>Robert Weil wrote:
>> >Might be a storm in a teacup, does this make any sense to anyone out
>> there? Or shall I book my rest cure in the nice white hotel?
>> >
>> >Rob
>> >
>> >Yes, a LOT. I too have been undergoing some major 'letting go'' very
similar to this you speak of, both of some individuals, and whole groups of
them, whole 'social sets', you might say.

Thank you Jennel, :)

What a relief to get your feedback! I've been going through this for 18
months. It makes much more sense now I see its larger energy context. I've
been ricocheted around many different viewpoints in the struggle to
understand, and it gave me an interdependent reality teaching, but it was
so painful. Sometimes when my personality reasserts itself I find myself
tumbling along one of those tunnel realities that go to old rotten places.
Only now I recognise it as incomplete, and wait for it to pass.

The letting go for me had to be done right so that those different
viewpoints could be synthesised into something that made a higher sense to
me, or else I'd just wake up in the night with the cold sweats again. I
think I've done it right, and I can grieve for what was in a clean way now.
I can also move on as me, without that bloody hall of mirrors!

>This for exactly the same reason, I have just gone (grown?) too far beyond
them (and I don't mean that to so8nd 'better than')

I know, you just realise the truth... :)

>they simply cannot 'see' what I see, they still walk under the veil of the

For me it feels like a kind of strange blindness, they themselves are as
"light" as me, but the world appears dark in their eyes, and it contains
evils to wipe out, rather than being filled with light made from things
they don't understand yet. They will meet experiences that will require
them to expand their conceptions! Happened to me, thanks to them... :)

>that can only feel toward me either hostility, or pity, for their thinking
I'm crazy or something. I do not have hostile feelings toward them, only
sorrow, and am having to let go of frustrations of realizing I can never
''change' them, for they simply are not yet ready for that, to awaken.

Yes. How strange and sad it feels. The heart heals in mysterious ways, it
seems. I tried so hard to keep the doors open for them, and now I thank the
powers that be for keeping me sane and teaching me to trust myself more.
Why do we get so caught up in these situations? And why do we insist on
accidentally generating reactions that show us our fears? <g>

>I have to leave that in god's hands, to deal with them when and as He
will, as to awakening to >truth. but relationship with them has become
simply unsustainable, and a source of nothing but >unpleasant ness on both

Yes, so tempting to stand up and show *them* how it feels. I could see how
the breakdown in communication was deliberate on their part, in order to
maintain their preconceptions, and it was actually threatening to them to
open up to embrace a larger perspective, threatening to their
mental/emotional structures which they "needed" to maintain their opinions
and status. Some of it so subtle, using psycho-spiritual terms to justify
the coldness. This was their way of maintaining their Way. Karma in action.

And I was melting all the while, cast out (old karma), nothing to offer but
an intention to expand my heart, but no means to express. Lucky for me, new
friends, and some validation from them and from here. Life is accepting,
and allows new life. Pity we impose such limited, damning views on each other.

This angel stuff I mentioned was a surprise, and came after I had decided
to let the ppl I was in pain over just go their way: it seems to me that
there's some work going on on the old inner planes, through the change of
energy. I don't hope for personal vindication any more, but if this energy
brings a broadening of our capacity to love, I welcome it gratefully. I
shall move on anyway.

Thanks, Jennell, 'scuse the long ramble!




Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 16:59:31 EST
From: KungaJigmeATnospamaol.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] did everyone get this post of Amanda's?


I've not heard from Amanda since 12/22!


Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 15:51:37 -0800
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Subject: Fwd: Please forward to list: Throat Chakra

>To: "Mystress Angelique Serpent" <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
>Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 18:28:12 0000
>From: "winter mute" <mumblecatATnospamangelfire.com>
>X-Sent-Mail: on
>X-Mailer: MailCity Service
>Subject: Please forward to list: Throat Chakra
>Organization: Angelfire (http://email.angelfire.com:80)
>Hi Mystress,
>Since ppl have had problems lately
>receiving my posts sent to Topica,
>as suggested, this may be forwarded
>to the list.
>On beforehand, thanks.
>Hi list,
>On Wed, 12 Jan 2000 07:53:13 Marion Hanvey wrote:
>>My throat chakra is opening. (Think someone mentioned that on the list.
>>I'm not being rude about not remembering who - lost letters)
>:) That would be me.
>>Also there is a nadi
>>connecting one of the lower chakras to the throat chakra. Think someone
>>mentioned this too. The nadi is not in the body but in front of it - sort
>>of like a bow - from lower chakra to throat chakra.
>Yes, this could very well be.
>There are thousands of nadis in the body
>and they may be open to different degrees
>in diff. individuals. :)
>If it's important for you to know
>which lower chakra the throat chakra is
>connected to, you may ask your guides
>about it.
>>I'm not that well up on the chakras even if I did once read
>>"The Serpent Power".
>Genevieve Paulson's book
>"Kundalini and the Chakras" is pretty good,
>gives nice descriptions of the different
>chakras and presents chakras in other than
>the physical body.
>Amazon.com has it. :)
>>Anyway, what I am writing for is to ask if anybody knows anything about
>>because I seem to have acquired one or two on my head too.
>>The first one I noticed is at the crown of my head. You know where your
>>hair starts to swirl towards the back of the crown, well there only in the
>>middle. The other one is more towards the front of the top of the head,
>>off-centre to the left. Think I might be acquiring a matching one on the
>>right as well. They're only small.
>G. Paulson describes a ring of smaller chakras
>on the head and a series of small chakras
>going from the Ajna and up the forehead.
>These chakras may be seen as individual
>chakras, or as belonging to the Sahasrara, it
>depends on how you want to see it.
>My personal experience is that there is a
>small but intense chakra at the top of the
>forehead where the hair line begins,
>and even a small one above that, hovering
>a few inches above the head.
>These could well belong to other bodies
>than the physical, it's hard to say. :)
>And vary from person to person.
>I also notice small chakras set in a ring
>around the head, above the ears and one
>at the base of the neck and one above there.
>There are also energy centers inside the head,
>probably being connected with the
>pituitary and hypothalamus, the amygdala,
>the brain stem and the optic nerves
> and eye muscles. (That last place is
> a painful place to get an energy squiggle in
>and I'm having one right now. Ooouuuw ! ;) )
>There are also energy centers in the face,
>right below the cheekbones and at the
>side of the chin.
>But these may also be seen as tubes in the
>non physical body, nadis, rather than
>spinning circles of energy.
>Best regards,

 Mystress Angelique Serpent, http://www.domin8rex.com
  Vancouver, B.C., Canada. Officially the most beautiful city in the world.
8) :D ;) :0 :) ;P ;) :D |* ;) 8D :)
 <<<< I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery
 <<<< than live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it.
 <<<< -- Harry Emerson Fosdick



Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 23:07:00 EST
From: CKRESSATnospamaol.com
CC: SacredKundaliniATnospamonelist.com
Subject: Interesting Perspective

I received an email from a Sufi teacher pertaining to Kundalini which I found
very interesting. He gave me his permission to post it to the list. (At the
end of his post are some comments I sent in reply to him.)

In a message dated 1/14/00 3:45:11 AM Pacific Standard Time,
puranATnospamappliedmeditation.org writes:

 > << I'm a meditation teacher in the Sufi tradition. I've mastered Samadhi,
 > the goal of Kundalini work, to the point that my heartbeat stopped for five
 > minutes in clinical tests in a hospital here in Boston. Also the Delta
 > in my EEG were very high, higher than in deep sleep. These waves are the
 > slowest of all brain waves and when produced consciously are another
 > indicator of Samadhi. Furthermore, I have many students that have done
 > things. Of course these are just the outer indications; the inner
 > is one of being beyond life, space, and time, similar to death, in order to
 > conquer death's fear and understand life.
 > But after 30 years of experience with Samadhi, I've stopped teaching it.
 > First, it's just too dangerous. It can easily lead to a variety of mental
 > disorders that one doesn't see coming. It's not the "fast path" that many
 > think because it takes a long time to recover from the disassociativeness.
 > Second, it's not helpful to a life in the world. Samadhi was developed for
 > use in a monastic setting. It's amazing and wondrous, but it's only
 > half-way. The second half of the path, according to the Sufis, is bringing
 > the realization of Samadhi back home and living it out. But for that, the
 > method needs to be completely different. Bringing it home uses the
 > energy, flowing in the spine in opposition to Kundalini. Also, if you see
 > "Living from the Heart" as the goal, then enormous progress can occur
 > much Kundalini. So the meditation to practice in the downward type --
 > the harder part. Kundalini rises on its own, given even a slight boost
 > conscious breathing. The harder part is to steer that energy into the
 > and let it express itself in heart-centered behavior.
 > Third, it's been done. The frontier of human consciousness has moved on in
 > the last three thousand years. There are new challenges today, challenges
 > that are as exciting as it must have been for Yogi Patanjali and later the
 > Buddha to explore the world "beyond time and no time, beyond space and no
 > space, beyond existence and no existence." Instead of aspiring to NO
 > thoughts, I aspire to ALL emotions, all at once.
 > If you are interested in the meditation of OUR time, concentrate on your
 > heart, not your etheric body. It's safe, it's practical, and it's very
 > challenging.
 > The Web site for the Institute of Applied Meditation is a good place to
 > start. http://www.appliedmeditation.org
 > Blessings from the heart,
 > Puran Bair
 > >>


The following are my comments to Puran:

While I never developed your discipline for entering Samadhi states at will
(or being able to suspend my biological functions), I began having
spontaneous Samadhi states in the 60's and and Kundalini rose of its own
accord (I was doing no practices to awaken it) in '91. I have experienced
Kundalini-related phenomena daily ever since. I am very impressed by the
innovative view you've expressed. I agree entirely with your emphasis on
allowing oneself to experience the full range of emotions. In both the
modern secular world and in many religious circles, emotion is regarded as an
impediment to clarity of mind and spirit. I find that the opposite is true.
Emotion and symbolic perception are both instinctual and primal intelligence:
the language of the body and soul.

The heart speaks most clearly through emotion and feeling. My heart chakra
radiates heat whenever I am in the presence of someone with great
heart-energy, which is how I can immediately identify them. In a similar
manner, I am moved to tears by anything that expresses love. This is how I
can distinguish the authentic from the imitation (which pervades so much
religious/metaphysical/psychological lore).

I used to push away emotional reactions of fear, anger, hurt, etc. when
interacting with others, under the mistaken idea that these were judgmental
responses. Now I appreciate them as an internal barometer which informs me
when something is crying for attention : either something in the
attitudes/ideas/behaviors of another needs to be addressed, and/or I need to
re-examine my own motives and attachments. Sticking with feelings of
fear/anger/woundedness invariably takes me to new levels of awareness and
preserves (or restores) my integrity while enabling me to stay true in
relationship to others.

Best Wishes,
El Collie

Shared Transformation


Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 18:25:16 -0800
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Subject: Fwd: Re: TOPICA Feedback Form (KMM509361C0KM)

>Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 17:29:57 -0800
>To: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
>Subject: Re: TOPICA Feedback Form (KMM509361C0KM)
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Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 23:17:13 -0600
From: Jenell <anglfthrATnospamiamerica.net>
CC: kundaliniATnospamtopica.com, SacredKundaliniATnospamonelist.com
Subject: Re: [K-list] Interesting Perspective

Oh my gosh! The ability to alter brain waves so as to read on EEG as
deep sleep while awake, I demonstrated, over 20 yrs ago, much to the
consternation of the tech trying to run the EEG, that kept telling me to
wake up, not go to sleep, upon which I did it while looking right at her
and TALKING to her to proove i WASN'T going to sleep! It was when i do
what i've most my life called my 'going away' thing. i have used it
since a child, for times when I have to be here, but dont want to be
here. i am awake, aware, but non reactive to much that is happening to
me. Works great in a dentist's chair, or when enduring severe pain. Also
great for staying calm in traffic jams, or otherwise when you have to
just pass time, like when they tell you to lay still while they run a
boring EEG test, it makes time seem to go faster, like something of a
mental 'time warp' effect. I just tune out and go away for the duration
needed, while keeping a pretty much unemotional conscious awareness here
at the same time.


ckressATnospamaol.com wrote:
> I received an email from a Sufi teacher pertaining to Kundalini which I found
> very interesting. Also the Delta
> waves
> > in my EEG were very high, higher than in deep sleep. These waves are the
> > slowest of all brain waves and when produced consciously are another
> > indicator of Samadhi.


Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 00:37:43 EST
From: "Steven Truex" <christ_yogiATnospamhotmail.com>
Subject: Hope this question is all right`

--------Hello all,
  I believe Amanda (sorry if it was someone else) wrote this.
  , you may ask your guides
--------How does a person do this?


Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 08:00:09 +0100
From: "Magne Aga" <magneagaATnospammonet.no>
Cc: "Wim Borsboom" <aurasphereATnospamhome.com>, <kundaliniATnospamtopica.com>
Subject: Re: Crucifixion-Resurrection Initiation


Dear Jenell. In your posting on Jan 14th, you mentioned *polarity shifts*.
First of all, let me announce a *catastrophe*: The paper I once wrote,
several years ago, and recited parts of in my previous posting, is lost!
Only fragments remains on my computer. It was entitled *Reflections about
the Holy Grail* - and became reading stuff within several secret societies.

Today, only remniscents, fragments remains - some in Norwegian, some in
english - and I've actually spend some time with reconstruction attempts.
*Reconstruting fragments* ! A nice analogy to the work done in the time
period succeeding an Initiation !

Anyway, two poles: Yin and Yang, masculine and feminine.... You recited the
following part of my posting:

>> . The main result of these process, is
>> the *horisontal bar*, a certain connection between the pineal gland
>> and the pituitary gland, which didn't exist before these process. The
>> two chakras in the heads establishes a new Ying-Yang polarity, the
>> masculine and feminine aspects of the primordial force, *Father and
>> Mother*.

The pituitary gland, in conjunction with Manas Chakra (Thalamus) - one of
the secondary, esoteric Chakras in the head - is an OBSERVER. Everything you
do, say, think, feel is observed. You live in happiness and Joy, and these
Chakra observes and smiles.... You experience misery and pain, and the same
Chakra observes - and smiles. The All-Seeing Eye receives impressions. It's
the feminine, receiving part. "I've been watching you", as Sting sings in
the song. But there's one thing it doesn't: It doesn't initiate action! It
performs no actions!

The pituitary and the pineal glands are the passive-active, the
receiving-giving, the feminine-masculine poles in these *waterline* crossing
the head with the Kundalini force. The waterline and the Lotus is an ancient
Eastern symbol of the process. The lotus have it's roots in the mud (root
chakra); it's stilk grows upwards through the water (astral planes); and the
Lotus flower, swimming on the waterline, opening up for the Sun - is the 7th
chakra with 1000 blades. What a coincidence it is, that I at the present
time translates the *Saddharmapundarika Sutra*, the *White Lotus Sutra* into

I have to recite parts of my previous posting in '98, in order to explain
the necessity of the connection between these two poles in the head:

> But in order to succeed in these UNITY, our old fragmented ego must die,
beeing absorbed by a higher unity. The Choice is given, whether to destroy
the Ego, and give up ones Life, extending it to Universal Life, or whether
he making protection mechanisms around the Ego and abide therein.
> In order to achieve UNITY, in order to CROSS THE ABYSS, one must
emancipate from thought by putting each idea against its opposite, and
refuse to prefer either. Through Jnana Yoga - the meditation technique
called “Antar Mouna” (Inner Silence), we self-destruct our limitations.
> We must then decide upon the ciritical adventure, the absolute abandonment
of our glory and personal achievements. We cannot remain indefinetly upon
the Pillars of Mercy, because these pillars (Ida and Pingala) have become
unstable, imbalanced. We are beeing pushed onwards by the irresistable
momentum that have been generated. The old Ego cannot guide us, it is beeing
DIVIDED INTO THREE PERSONALITIES, and we must choose between the TRINITY of
the White way, or a split personality case as seen in *the three faces of
> Should he fail, through cowardice, in making these self-anihilation
complete, he is nevertheless pushed into the ABYSS. But instead of beeing
reborn from the tomb on the other side, in order to be one Self as one never
have been before, he DIVES into the ABYSS, hiding the elements around the
Ego as if isolated from the Universe, and becomes a *dark brother*, a *black
> Such a beeing gradually disintegrates from lack of nurture, and the slow
but increasing lack of interest for the rest of the Universe, despite his
now so desperate attempts to isolate and protect himself, and aggregandize
himself through predatory practice.
>It is only FEAR which prevents us from CROSSING the ABYSS (white magic) or
DIVING into the Abyss (black magic). If our fear becomes too big, we are
gradually sinking into the sewage system of the three, becoming a part of
it's refusal.

Our conscious mind is like a torch. It enlightens a very small area, and the
surrounding environment is darkness. In order to understand esoteric stuff,
we must move the torch, move the assemblage point of consciousness. All we
do - and all we have to do, when performing magic, is moving the assemblage
point of consciousness.

Beneath the everyday awake state, there are three different states of
consciousness, defined in present science by the EEG-brainwaves: Dream-sleep
(Alpha), Dreamless sleep (Theta) and a deeper state, Delta, beneath these
plane. In the awake state, our brain emanates Beta-waves.

These planes corresponds to the consciousness of the natural kingdoms:
(a) Mineral kingdom - Delta
(b) Vegetable kingdom - Theta
(c) Animals - Alpha
(d) Humans - Beta

The minerals have a physical body, but no etheric life-force body or astral
body. Vegetables do have the life-force (prana) body, but no astral body.
The live in dreamless sleep!

During meditation, the brain emanates Beta and Alpha waves simoultan-iously.
Further, the amounts of these brainwaves are twice the strength than during
ordinary dreaming and the awake state. Therefore, the Maharishi movement
talks about *resting clarity* during TM as *the fourth state of
consciousness* (actually the FIFTH), *turiya*, mentioned in the vedic books.

It's well-known how the Shamans of ancient cultures developed the *art of
dreaming* - beeing conscious during dreaming. But the consciousness can
awake on even deeper levels. The Initiation process, such as I experience
it, is the growing ability to be awake on all the three planes beneath our
ordinary human consciousness.

When we CROSS the ABYSS, we gain the ability to become conscious even at the
level of the minerals. The assemblage point of consciousness moves between
three sub-conscious levels. But without UNITY, without these *waterline* in
the head, a catastrophe will occur. During fatal LSD-trips, for example,
where people becomes *enduring hanged up there*, and never returns to
ordinary consciousness, it is actually the assemblage point of consciousness
which becomes ENTRAPPED in another dimension.

Without the UNITY between the pineal and the pituarity glands, the
connection between the assemblage points on the three levels (Delta, Theta,
Alpha) would be broken, and a split-personality case, *the three faces of
Eve*, would emerge. It's only Spirit, the ungraspable I AM, which can keep
these fragments together.

Without the equally proportioned polarity between the feminine and the
masculine Chakra in the head, *Father* and *Mother*, the *child*, the *Son
of God* entering downwards through the throath Chakra, would be DEAD BORN.
While Kundalini moves towards UNITY, the Pearl of Compassion moves towards
DIVERSITY when it - and our ego - becomes splintered into Ten thousand
Pieces during crucifixion, but it's only Ajna and Sahashrara in cooperation
which can ressurect the new-born child of the High Self.

During the crucifixion of Jesus, all of the 12 disciples (7 primary + 5
secondary Chakras) were SLEEPING. Only John, Love, the Heart Chakra, was
active. Similary, during the downwards movement of the Pearl, all chakras
becomes passive - except anahata, the hearth chakra.

As I wrote in these lost paper:

>Just as the mystics in ancient Egypt, Greece, and Rome cleansed their
astral bodies for years, before *mirroring* it into the etheric life-force
body - which was removed temporarily from the physical body just as during
*death* - such was it during my first Initiation (Birth), these ritual
Invocation of the Fire in the middle of the night, that my Breath and Heart
suddendly stopped.
>The First Fire (Kundalini) moved from the root chakra to the hearth, were
it had a rest in a *chamber*, mentioned as *hridaya akasham* in the Tantra
tradition. When Kundalini reached the Heart, the second Fire appeared.
>The second Fire is called Jivatman (Spirit of Life), and it's meditative
symbol is an *unmoveable, dark-blue flame from a lamp of oil*. The
unmoveable flame symbolize that I AM THAT I AM cannot be disturbed by outer
noise, nor our own lower personality. The anchored, inner Silence, can not
be disturbed by any noise.
>Kundalini continued it's journey. It reached the 96-bladed lotus in the
wrongly called *the 2-bladed lotus* in traditional Yoga.
>In the head the third Fire appeared, and an energy correspondence between
Jivatman and my Holy Guardian Angel was established. The energy began to
circulate between the head and the heart chakras.
>The third eye Chakra is a center of a cosmic mirror game. Our Holy Guardian
Angel is a phase-shifting reflection, a mirror of ourselves as we comes from
the physical world. We think about ourselves in terms of Past and Future,
instead of the Eternal NOW, and these fragments, these reflections,
congregates into a sort of meta-reality.
>Three kinds of Fire meets in the head. The first fire, Kundalini, gives a
magical vision of a smouldering glow in the body. This is the light from the
physical atoms in the body. The second fire from the heart seems like
*electrical sparks* from the pranic life-force body. The third Fire emanates
from our Holy Guardian Angel.
>Under this scenario, the three forms of fire are testing our lower
personality to a degree unknown for unitiates. They offer power over other
persons life. They offer an envoying reputation. They are telling you that
you shall not forgive your "enemies". The One way suddenly gets divided. On
the one hand, you are given the opportunity to continue your lower
personality life on a tempting, "light" way. On the other hand, you can
choose the I Am Self way to the other side, passing the dark Void.
>In the middle of the Sun in the head, our socially made "Ego" then gets
whirvled into a dark centre, an irresistible, horrifying Void (KALI) which
in Her insatiability consumes everything which comes within Her reach.
>The Dark Void is the Gate of Initiation. *The Light Shines on the Way* (the
secret doctrine)
>The consciousness suddendly awakes in a spiritual world, and identifies
itself with Life instead of form. The consciousness breaks through it's
limits to the divine and mighty I AM THAT I AM, which is neither form,
breath, thoughts or feelings, but a wonderful PEACE transcending the
language. The expansion is so intense that one discover that one never
before has known oneself. Everything which was considered as consciousness
before, is subconscious compared to the presence of I AM.
>When Moses, AFTER CLIMBING TO THE TOP OF SINAI (Kundalini's way upwards),
was asked about the name of God, he received the answer "ahijer (21) asher
(501) ahijeh", I AM THAT I AM. The summary of "ahijeh asher ahijeh" is 543,
and - since Moses is 345 - refers to the mirror in the third eye. The
summary of these numbers is 888, the value of Jesus.

In my last posting i wrote:

>> In the black magic, “left-hand” rituals of Tantra, on the other hand,
they renounce every tabus, breaks every laws of compulsion. They DRINK from
the Grail. They are no more total givers of themselves, but mean hucksters.
They exchange gold for dross. They sell their higher powers for gross and
temporary benefit. Through the conscious practice of breaking every tabu,
through BLASPHEMY, they seek Gnosis or Liberation.
>> The black magic Tantric Cults of the Vama Marg used the pig as a
blasphemic symbol because it eats human excrements. It explains why the
tantric Pra-Yoga left-hand magicians tried to prevent Buddha´s awakening
through magic power, by ridiculing his Divinity through pig-meat. There lies
a deep, deep mystery hidden in these symbolism, which not even Blavatsky
dared to reveal.

These deep mystery, which Blavatsky didn't DARE to reveal, concerns the
black magic adepts, and I can recite from my paper in order to put it in
connection with what I wrote above. But first of all, let's look at some
statements in the Quabbalah:

From the Jewish "Sepher Jezirah", I quote:

"In the 32 most occult and wonderful paths of wisdom, did JHVH, the Lord of
Hosts, Tzabaoth, Elohi of Israel, Alhim of Life, The El of Mercy and
Compassion, engrave his name . . . He created this universe by the three
Sepharim, Number, Writing, and Speech."

B-S'ph-er V-S'ph-r V-S'ph-r
 (346) + (340) + (340) = 1026

"10 are the numbers, as are the Sephiroth, and 22 the letters; these are
the Foundation of all things. Of these letters, 3 are mothers, 7 are
double, and 12 are simple."

"The 10 numbers formed from NO-THING (AIN), are the Decad; these are seen
in the fingers of the hands, 5 on one, 5 on the other, and over them is the
Covenant by voice spiritual, and the rite of Circumcision, corporeal (as of

"10 are the numbers of the ineffable Sephiroth, 10 and not 9, 10 and not
11. Learn this wisdom, and be wise in the understanding of it; investigate
these numbers, and draw knowledge from them. ...."

The Three of Life (The Spine) is buildt around 10 Sephirots and 22 Paths
(The 7 Chakras and their interconnections). One would assume the existence
of an 11. Sephira in the Three. These place is dedicated the Sphere of
DAATH, or Knowledge, which is the Child of Chokmah (2) and Binah (3). As it
is written: "Draw Knowledge from them".

But it is not shown in the Three, because it's a Knowledge from a Higher
Dimension which grows VERTICALLY from the Three of Life.

Not only is the Three of Life a TRULY LIVING THREE from which another Three
grows (The Three of Knowledge forming the 33th); the two directions forms a

If DAATH should be drawn in the Three, it would need extra "Paths" leading
to it. But it is said that the Ways of Wisdom are 32, that is 10 Emanations
("10 and not 9", "10 and not 11") and their 22 interconnections. Therefore
we find an "Abyss," and no direct link between Binah (3) and Chesed (4).
Binah and Chesed is the two Chakras in the head, and the interconnection
between them corresponds with the CROSSING OF THE ABYSS.

>"The Knowledge" (Da'ath) is the magical order BEHIND the Three in the story
about Man's *fall from grace*. While the frontside respresents the present
and future powers of the magician, the backside express pre-human and
atavistic influences. When crossing the Abyss, we automatically Invoke *The
Guardian of the Threshold*, called Chozzar. Chozzar (Neptun) means *pig*,
and was the Shadowy God, worshipped by the black-magician left-hand adepts
on Atlantis and symbolized by the fork of Neptun, the fork of the Abyss. The
chaldeic letter *Shin*, with it's THREE TONGUES OF FIRE, likewise means Set

Blavatsky states:

"The Garden of Eden as a locality is no myth at all; it belongs to those
landmarks of history which occasionally disclose to the student that the
Bible is not all mere allegory. Eden, or the hebraic GAN_EDEN, meaning the
park or garden of Eden, is an archaic name of the country watered by
Euphrates an its many branches, from Asia and Armenia to the Erythian Sea.
In the Chaldean Book of Numbers, its location is designated in numerals, and
in the chiper manuscript, left by Count St.Germain, it is fully
described.... Instead of becoming a neophyte, and gradually obtaining
esoteric knowledge through a regular initiation, an ADAM, or man, using his
intuitional faculties, and, prompted by the Serpent - Woman and matter -
tastes of the Three of Knowledge - the esoteric or secret doctrine -

(Isis Unveiled, I, p.575)

In a 1996, my twin soul dreamed that She visited me where I then lived. When
touching my left hand, she saw that it had grown demonic. These was
previous to my experience of astral attacks.

On June 20th, 1997, She received the following channeling in Theta, after
having some glimpses of The Ultimate Extreme Ligth:

"Have You seen The Face of Buddha or The Kauric Dimension ?"

Then She saw a graphical figure, burning.

Then She saw my left hand cut off, laying on the floor with a green ligth

These sign is called KES in old norse; its a rune which burns. Kes is the
symbol of our Guiding INNER LIGTH, The Beacon of Ligth (as is Da'ath) for
the Seeker. In the old norse mythology about Kes, it's said that a God had
to cut off his left hand in order to save the World. These is an extreme
syncronism, since the 3'rd person involved studied runes at these time.

Likewise, in the old Norwegian version of the Three of Life, another Three
grows out from it. It is also peculiar to observe that His Path of
Initiation is called "Yar-Gi-Sang-Thal-Chen-Po" - The Great Straigthforward
UPWARDS (VERTICAL) Way (Towards The Clear, Original Ligth seen after Death),
the oral base of The Tibetan Book of Death, characterized as very dangerous,
as it has only two possible outcomes: SUDDEN LIBERATION or ETERNAL

Sudden liberation, without any spesific methods, is implied in the concept
of the "effort-less" and "natural" liberated sage. It is the concept that
perfect awakening is something connecting to our everyday life, that the
highest initiation is to realize our Buddha-nature, our Christ-Self without
eliminating the "dirt" at the first stage.

The direct awakening is a result of an abrubtly conversion in the depths of
the counsciousness, so all dualism is thrown away. Our consciousness is
compared to the MIRROR of imagination which consequently reflects all forms
and images in front of it.

In Blavatsky's "Secret Doctrine", she mentiones "the 8th Sphere" with a few
words, stating that it could not be discussed officially. The socalled "8th
sphere" becomes clear, when looking at the 4 states of consciousness
mentioned in the beginning of these posting. When we begin to be conscious
at the subconscious level - we can count SEVEN states of consciousness.

Those who do not succeed in the Direct Way Upwards, ends up in a "Sphere"
beyond these seven - the sphere of damnation.

So, we have two explanations of the Chakra system in the Quabbalah and in
the Far East, where they use 7 and 10 "spheres", respectivly, and where the
"8th sphere", like Da'ath (the 11th) is the FORBIDDEN.

Which - again gives meaning to one of the verses in the Revelation:

> 3 So he carried me away in the spirit
> into the wilderness:
> and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet colored beast,
> full of the names of BLASPHEMY,
> having SEVEN heads and TEN horns.

Here I have to leave off, a substansial cosmology undiscovered and



Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 10:46:09 +0000
From: Martin Thompson <martinATnospamtucana.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [K-list] Opinions please? (reply in plain text)

04:30:33 Wed, 12 Jan 2000
Ville Vainio at Ville Vainio <vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi> writes:
>This is really annoying, IMO. My Vote goes for Onelist. I don't want to
>see the "unsubcribe from this list by..." either.
I find the message baffling: why is it phrased as an imperative? Do they
*want* us to unsubscribe?
Martin Thompson martinATnospamtucana.demon.co.uk
London, UK
   Home Page: http://www.tucana.demon.co.uk
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