To: K-list
Recieved: 1999/09/20 12:24
Subject: Re: [K-list] seemingly stupid questions about K
From: Ville Vainio
On 1999/09/20 12:24, Ville Vainio posted thus to the K-list:
On Mon, 20 Sep 1999, Martin Thompson wrote:
> >It doesn't matter what the point is, it's a biological fact that the grip
> >of ego will be weakened with awakening of k. It's not something you have
> >to do or strive for, it just happens.
> >
> I think that that is the way with integration: it just happens (perhaps
> when a certain amount of conscious and unconscious processing has been
> done on whatever issue it was that needed to be integrated).
I really don't understand what integrating the ego would mean. With what
will it be integrated? Ego is quite simply a feeling, or a collection of
feelings, in our head. And I have noticed the reduction in the intensity
of those ego-feelings.
> > or a
> >person that gets enlightenment does not exist anymore.
> Yes and no. Certainly, the person as a body is still there, but whether
Of course.
> they exist otherwise I think depends on whether their ego has been
> destroyed (Eastern style, they are reduced to being a social unit, i.e.,
> less but whole) or integrated (Western style, they become more but
> whole).
I don't see the connection between eastern style ego destruction and
"social unit". On the contrary, I think "social unit" is a more valid term
for a person who is operating on the level of higher ego activity.
> >> Big deal. But if that's so, why does self-consciousness seem such a
> >> barrier to it when that is part of who we are too?
> >
> >Part of what? What does "part of who we are" mean? This implies that there
> >is something that we "are", which can "contain" other things. Which is not
> >exactly true.
> I don't really mean it in that sense: I mean it is an aspect, a feature,
> a property.
Yes, I understood that. The emphasis was not on "contain". I wanted to
point out that self-consciousness being a feature of "who we are" is not
really important, as "who we are" is not anything. Who is conscious of
self? The self? Is there a perceiver that is conscious of self? I was
thinking along those lines...
Ville Vainio - vvainioATnospamtp.spt.fi http://www.tp.spt.fi/~vvainio
We're all puppets
The first step on the path to understanding is seeing the strings
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