To: K-list
Recieved: 1999/09/03 05:21
Subject: [K-list] Answer to MHortling, CC:d to K-list
From:
On 1999/09/03 05:21, A list member posted thus to the K-list:
On Thu, 2 Sep 1999 MHortlingATnospamaol.com wrote:
> hey there and terve !
Terve!
> experiences with the great Mother-Energy. Like yourself, my initial mystical
> experience and kundalini-arousal came about through experimentation with a
> psycho-active substance (cannabis in my case) over 20 years ago. I then had a
Actually, I had my samadhi with psychoactive substances. I describe on my
pages the state I was in after that samadhi... it was somehow similar to
kundalini, but only the positive effects were apparent. I don't know if I
should call it kundalini; probably I shouldn't, as that word has been
abused so much that it should be used with extreme discretion :-).
> second kundalini rising a few years later which left me psychologically and
> physically shattered for a number of years, not very much unlike Gopi
> Krishna. Finally the Energy became permanently active a few years ago after
I was psychologically shattered for a few months. I bet going through the
same thing for few years must be an ordeal...
> intensive hatha-yoga practice and I am now living in something of an
> intermediate state, with a lot of unpleasantness and fluctuation still going
> on whithin although the foundation of the consciousness and my sense of
> identity is by now becoming more and more firmly rooted in the experience of
> higher (and truer) consciousness.
Glad to hear it. I know that unpleasantness and fluctuation can be
tolerated in the perspective of higher consciousness. And now I also know
that I will have the fluctuation for at least 18 years from now ;-).
> Anyway, as for the information on your site, I find it agrees with my own
> experience to quite a large degree. Our perception seems to differ in the
Good to know. I think it's important for the beginners in the path (for
whom I primarily wrote a lot of the articles for... the info I would have
needed but I didn't have) to know that they are not alone with it. It's
nice to get some agreeing comments from a K-veteran.
> importance accorded to the concept of the chakras however. In my experience
> the chakras seem to constitute the basic building blocks of our consciousness
> or, put in a different way, the primal energy or shakti takes shape as
I don't disagree with you, I just told that I myself have no significant
experience with them and preaching about chakras to someone whose main
interest is whether he is going insane would be counterproductive. He
might think that "oh my, I don't know what this chakra thing is all about,
it's probably not K". Possibly I will have more chakra experiences later
on, I can't tell.
> thoughts and finally the physical body. The samadhi experience then, to me
> seems to be the energy withdrawing from the shapes it created and
> experiencing itself in the original pure form. I believe I have had some
My samadhi was more like my consciousness plunging into itself
recursively, accompanied by lost sense of time, and *boom*, there we are.
Quite a bit like lucky accident, really.
> experience of these centers and their location whithin the body since one of
> the major stumbling blocks on my journey have been chakras that were jammed
> shut after the second kundalini-experience
> ( too much power, too soon probably - but then again, as you so aptly wrote:
Too much power too soon is probably the problem with every sudden K
arousal.
> there is no such thing as free will or choice....-not to mention bad luck or
> faulty genetics). In fact it has taken me years of patient (and often furious
Faulty genetics is possibly the most cruel explanation one could be
given..."sorry, can't help, you have bad genes". Some spiritual literature
I have read mentions it, and it must be quite common for sensitive
K-active people to freak out on such explanations.
> and impatient) effort to slowly open the psychic centers again and I'm still
> struggling with it today.
I don't really think in terms of centers... when I'm feeling unspiritual I
just feel that I'm spiritually jammed. Even though I do feel some form of
energy rushing to my mind along my back (very subtle experience, possibly
placebo) when I regain the spiritual feeling, I'm cautious to make any
conclusions. It's just stuff that happens.
> Accordingly the physical experience of the chakras to me is very tangible
> (most people have had the experience of the lower chakras charging and and
> discharching during orgasm - real tantra takes that idea somewhat higher (pun
This must be a personal thing. I have only experiences with chakras
upwards from solar plexus, apart from the occasional tingling when K
"rises".
> intended..). Of course you are quite right in saying that the chakras, just
> as all other organs of the body are monitored and experienced by the brain as
> well. Makes one ponder now,doesn't it, where does the brain stop and the "I"
> come into play?
My chakra experiences have been very cerebral in nature... I just think
that my brain has cooked up something again. I believe that the "I" is in
the brain, and the world just exists. This could be discussed forever, in
vain.
> Secondly, there does seem to be a measurable agent moving along the spine and
> there's an Austrian called Gerhart Eggertsberger whose done considerable and
> scientific research on this (using bio-feedback on meditating tai-chi masters
> hooked up to measuring equipment etc.)
Hmmm... spinal column does transmit neural impulses, but I don't really
believe in any kind of "essence" travelling along the spine. Well, more
research is always needed, though I think there could be some more
productive approaches towards K research... PET, EEG studies etc.
> through the active shakti is a LOT more interesting and blissful - but the
> price at times seems to be enourmously high too. In India the science of
> kundalini-yoga is called Mahayoga or the Great Yoga granting both freedom and
> bliss. (It is true that they usually forget to mention the terror and the
> difficulties involved...)
And due to that, one that reports about the terrors may be labeled as
possessor of "faulty" K, or demons. And the frauds who do stupid stunts
and pretend to be seers/whatever get idolized.
> I'm in the procees of writing a detailed account of my long and strenous
> journey with the Motherforce, if you're interested send me an e-Mail and
> I'll mail it back to you as soon as it's ready -
By all means.
> Otherwise I'm very interested in just hearing of your experiences in detail
> and exchanching views- everybody seems to have their own individual and
I have already written a brief account (more like a psychiatric report,
really) of my experience, I guess I'll upload it one of these days. And
please do email your experience to me or the K-list when it's ready, I'd
like to read it...
> P.S I think I'll put this short note on the k-list too as it might perhaps be
> of interest to somebody else out there as well
As did I.
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