1998/04/13 10:48
kundalini-l-d Digest V98 #292
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 292
Today's Topics:
Re: All Shall Be Well [ Harsha1MTM <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com> ]
RE: Poem [ croatonATnospambanet.net (Jack ) ]
Re: All Shall Be Well [ Ann Morrison Fisher <annfisherATnospamstic ]
Re: Adrian [ Pat Williams <pwilliamATnospaminfocom.com> ]
Re: Not S&M . . . [ Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpent ]
Ways Of The Easter Warrior [ valerie cooper <madammumATnospamptialaska. ]
Re: Latif the Thief [ Dan Margolis <margolisATnospamtransbay.net ]
Re: Sufi/deserving "truth" [ "Ed Jason" <lobATnospamlineone.net> ]
Re: kundalini questions [ "John Heaton" <cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.c ]
Re: Adrian [ "Ed Jason" <lobATnospamlineone.net> ]
Re: Not S&M . . . [ "Ed Jason" <lobATnospamlineone.net> ]
Re: kundalini questions [ "John Heaton" <cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.c ]
Re: kundalini questions [ Harsha1MTM <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com> ]
Re: kundalini questions [ Harsh Luthar <hlutharATnospambryant.edu> ]
I Am That [ Jerry Katz <umbadaATnospamns.sympatico.ca> ]
Re: I Am That [ Harsh Luthar <hlutharATnospambryant.edu> ]
Re: all that enlightenment yadda yad [ Kathy <deliriumATnospamfull-moon.com> ]
Re: kundalini questions [ John Heaton <CttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com ]
enlightening/getting lighter [ hbarrettATnospamix.netcom.com (Holly N. Ba ]
Re: kundalini questions [ "Joseph Miller" <joemillerATnospamhotmail. ]
Re: kundalini questions [ "Mark A. Collins" <themacmanATnospammacsru ]
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 18:03:11 EDT
From: Harsha1MTM <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com>
To: samyanaATnospamhotmail.com, kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com, annfisherATnospamstic.net
Subject: Re: All Shall Be Well
Message-ID: <ab06a1ec.35313a21ATnospamaol.com>
In a message dated 4/12/1998 1:48:29 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
samyanaATnospamhotmail.com writes:
<< - From "Four Quartets" by T.S. Eliot
>
>----------------
>snip
> We shall not cease from exploration
>And the end of all our exploring
>Will be to arrive where we started
>And know the place for the first time.
<SNIP >>
Harsha: Let me add my thanks as well Ann. And thanks for pointing this out
Gloria. You have sharper eyes than mine. In my haste to scan through messages
I overlooked this the first time. It is a beautiful verse. It seems to nicely
describe the context of the spiritual search and Self-Realization.
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:21:46 GMT
From: croatonATnospambanet.net (Jack )
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: RE: Poem
Message-ID: <35313d78.18569901ATnospamsmtp.banet.net>
For FG,
And if I go,
While your still here........
Know that I live on,
Vibrating to a different measure
behind a veil you cannot see through
So you must have faith
I wait for the time when we
can soar together again
both aware of eachother
Until then, live your life to the fullest
and when you need me,
Just whisper my name in your heart
............ I will be there.
Anonymous
Jack
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 18:06:12 -0500
From: Ann Morrison Fisher <annfisherATnospamstic.net>
To: "Gloria Lee" <samyanaATnospamhotmail.com>
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: All Shall Be Well
Message-Id: <l03010d01b156f7526608ATnospam[207.71.50.213]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
"Gloria Lee" <samyanaATnospamhotmail.com> wrote:
>>- From "Four Quartets" by T.S. Eliot
>>
>>----------------
>>snip
>> We shall not cease from exploration
>>And the end of all our exploring
>>Will be to arrive where we started
>>And know the place for the first time.
><SNIP
>
>Thank you, Ann, for this most beautiful thought.
> But....is this not like OZ???
Is that good? Or is that bad? I think the world looks more like Oz to me
every day. :)))))))))) LOL :))))))))))) I love it!!
>Maybe we know "ourselves" too,
>for the first time, when we arrive where we started?
Maybe that's the point of it all?
Actually, these are two small bits from a long poem in four parts, and the
poem as a whole is anything but simple. I've been reading it for many
years now, and I always find something new to grasp in it. If you - or
anyone else - would like to read the whole thing, I'll be glad to send it
to you. It's already scanned - no trouble.
Love,
Ann
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 19:31:24 -0500 (EST)
From: Pat Williams <pwilliamATnospaminfocom.com>
To: kundalini-LATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Adrian
Message-Id: <3.0.16.19980412193645.226fcf58ATnospaminfocom.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Folks,
Am new to the list so I have not read this complete thread.
From a previous post someone worte:
The truth is people find 'the Truth' they deserve.
Perhaps a better way of saying this is, "People find 'the Truth' they
are looking for at this time in their life."
Pat
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 17:47:47 -0700
From: Mystress Angelique Serpent <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
To: <lobATnospamlineone.net>
Cc: "Kundalini list" <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Not S&M . . .
Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980412174747.00850760ATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Yup, actually that is exactly how S&M works.. and how would you know
anyways..??
Blessings, Mystress.
At 05:58 AM 11/04/98 -0700, Ed Jason wrote:
>When you feel pain, ask pardon of God;
>this pain has its uses.
>When He pleases, pain becomes joy;
>bondage itself becomes freedom.
>When you take a clear look,
>you'll see that from God
>are both the water of mercy and the fire of anger.
>
>(Masnavi, I:836-837; 852)
>
>
>
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 16:59:30 +0000
From: valerie cooper <madammumATnospamptialaska.net>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
CC: "HeartZen <heartzenATnospamlistserv.servtech.com> cpfire-lATnospam[129.180.48.2] Community of Friends" <friendsATnospamcuenet.com>
Subject: Ways Of The Easter Warrior
Message-ID: <3530F2ED.6B25ATnospamptialaska.net>
To all:
I find my new lifestyle as an employed graphic designer at the harbour a
bit unsettling; inasmuch as I have to come in on Easter to get my 500+
e-mails (which I could not possibly read them all!). A guy has an older
Mac SE bein pieced together for an at-home rig, with the old 14.4 modem
& NAVIGATOR version 1.12. Hey - whatever works - that's what is
happening!
Happy Easter & bah humbug it all anyway...
I am almost half moved into a fancy apartment up the hill with a
splendid view of the little toy town, with their little toy houses &
tourist shops & bars & churches & liquor stores (sinnerville...hehe).
Got me trusty binoculars right nearby in case I wish to view the boaters
going up the channel lookin for contraband. After all, this IS
'Tiajuana' of Alaska... (some luck!).
Well, as I told Amelia the 6 yr old daughter earlier on - 'Easter is not
about pretty clothes & going to church, then go home & forget about it.
The best way to serve God is to stay busy & pray ceaselessly & help
people all the time."
The way of the warrior is certainly a lonely & solitary path.
Bless you all !
in solidarity,
vc
ps (better remember not to cross-post kundalini - heartzen, or 'the
force' will bite yer booty!)
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 18:04:47 -0700
From: Dan Margolis <margolisATnospamtransbay.net>
To: lobATnospamlineone.net, Kundalini Mailing List <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Latif the Thief
Message-ID: <3350312F.49B9B5D9ATnospamtransbay.net>
Ed Jason wrote:
> A sufi story in the book 'Thinkers of the East" by Idries Shah describes
> this:
>
> One day Latif the Thief ambushed the commander of the Royal Guard,
> captured him and took him to a cave.
> 'I am going to say something that, no matter how much you try, you
> will be unable to forget,' he told the infuriated officer.
> Latif made his prisoner take off all his clothes. Then he tied him,
> facing backwards, on a donkey.
> 'You may be able to make a fool of me,' screamed the soldier, 'but
> you'll never make me think of something if I want to keep it out of my
> mind.'
> 'You have not yet heard the phrase which I want you to remember,'
> said Latif. 'I am turning you loose now, for the donkey to take you back
> to town. And the phrase is:
> '"I'll catch and kill Latif the Thief, if it takes me the rest of my
> life!"'
>
> fowarded by . . . I forget . . .
> probably Lobster
"Well Mr. Lobster, you may borrow my posting. You might even put it under
your own name, but I'll still probably forget about it in a few weeks."
Dan M.
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:04:06 -0700
From: "Ed Jason" <lobATnospamlineone.net>
To: "Gloria Lee" <samyanaATnospamhotmail.com>, <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com>
Cc: <Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Sufi/deserving "truth"
Message-Id: <199804130544.GAA11928ATnospamboober.lineone.net>
> Well, how can anyone know the way to truth unless they have already
> been there to recognize the place?? There is just ignorance and it has
> no connection whatsoever with "deserving or not deserving to arrive
> there.
We all have inner discernment. There is something in us that is Truth and it recognises itself. The reason so many of us are distracted and confused is because we choose to follow what we like, what is stimulating, what is fun. We deserve confusion and the results of ignorance because we bring these qualities to the equation.
In Sufism it is said nothing and no one can stop the serious aspirant from finding the truth.
Most people are not serious, genuine or even interested in any realistic or practical way on finding the truth. They get what they deserve. Their efforts provide their outcome.
Its a bit like someone saying 'everyone deserves to be a doctor'. Yes OK but not everyone has the capacity, opportunity or motivation.
> To shorten this tale of woe and ignorance, I believe the Oz analogy
> holds up well, as an answer. By journeying down the yellow brick road
> with our mistaken ideas and having adventures, we eventually arrive at
> Oz. Once we get there, we discover that the Scarecrow really did have a
> brain all along, and the TinMan also had a heart..and the Lion had
> courage..or was it the adventure of the journey itself which grew them??
> Is there really more than one yellow brick road??? Is there someplace
> other than OZ to arrive at??
All roads lead to Rome but not if you are on the yellow brick road. You have to decide if you are interested in a joke, a fantasy or reality.
Lobster
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 01:40:58 -0500
From: "John Heaton" <cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com>
To: "Harsha1MTM" <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com>, <joemillerATnospamhotmail.com>,
<kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com>, <keutzerATnospameecs.berkeley.edu>
Cc: <margolisATnospamtransbay.net>
Subject: Re: kundalini questions
Message-Id: <06333243749436ATnospamspringnet1.com>
----------
> In a message dated 4/12/1998 11:52:27 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> joemillerATnospamhotmail.com writes:
>
> << How any of the people
> who haven't had this kind of confirmation can be sure they have an
> awakening is what I find curious. >>
>
> Harsha: Hi Joe. Awakening of the Kundalini Shakti in meditation leads to
an
> immediate loss of body consciousness (but not consciousness). It is
quite
> dramatic. There is no mistaking it.
John:
Hi Joe and Harsha. Since I joined this list I have been mostly watching to
see what I can learn, but this really caught my attention.
If I may ask Harsha, what exactly do you mean awakening of the Kundalini
Shakti leads to an immediate loss of body consciousness? I had a rather
spontaneous experience last summer that sounds very much like this. I was
standing in my front yard breathing in the sunrise and thinking about how
our physical existence could be likened to a strobe light....flashing in
and out of existence, (and how our brain convienently deletes or simply
ignores the time we "are not here") when the 'world', myself included
"exploded" so to speak. In a flashing instant it was though everything was
made of tiny dots, in this instant all the dots just tore away from each
other and was gone....but "I" was still there. There was no darkness, no
light, no sight, no sound, no body...just nothing. Then, just as quickly,
everything "imploded" again (like a film of the explosion running in
reverse) and I was standing in my yard again. My stomach was churning a
bit, and I was very light headed. My whole body felt very light (except my
feet, which felt relatively heavy) and kinda strange, walking was plodding
and felt very mechanical. But this soon wore off.
I guess I am not sure just what I am asking you. This was not a reverie or
an imagination. It also is an isolated incident, nothing like it has
happened since. (the thought of being "there" for an extended period is a
bit intimidating...seems easy to get 'lost' and how would you know how long
you were gone?) What exactly is Kundalini Shakti?
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 10:12:05 -0700
From: "Ed Jason" <lobATnospamlineone.net>
To: <kundalini-LATnospamexecpc.com>, "Pat Williams" <pwilliamATnospaminfocom.com>
Subject: Re: Adrian
Message-Id: <199804130920.KAA06353ATnospamboober.lineone.net>
> Hi Folks,
>
> Am new to the list so I have not read this complete thread.
>
> From a previous post someone worte:
> The truth is people find 'the Truth' they deserve.
>
> Perhaps a better way of saying this is, "People find 'the Truth' they
> are looking for at this time in their life."
>
> Pat
Hi Pat,
Welcome,
There is always a way of saying things that we prefer. Better is a subjective evaluation. If this is better for you, use it. However let me put it another way:
Imagine that all the great mystics of the world have (despite the difficulties) placed their knowledge and experiences and the methods of attainment in printed format. People wail that they can not find the Truth. When you question them you find their supposed looking has been very superficial. People dedicate their whole life to this search. Not all are successful.
What then are you looking for 'K', 'Bliss', 'Wisdom' or 'Truth'? They are not all the same thing. And nobody is going to do the hard work of finding 'the Truth' for you.
Welcome.
Be Well
Lobster
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 07:20:22 -0700
From: "Ed Jason" <lobATnospamlineone.net>
To: "Mystress Angelique Serpent" <serpentATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Cc: "Kundalini list" <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Not S&M . . .
Message-Id: <199804130919.KAA04107ATnospamboober.lineone.net>
> Yup, actually that is exactly how S&M works.. and how would you know
> anyways..??
> Blessings, Mystress.
>
Rumi:
> >When you feel pain, ask pardon of God;
> >this pain has its uses.
> >When He pleases, pain becomes joy;
> >bondage itself becomes freedom.
> >When you take a clear look,
> >you'll see that from God
> >are both the water of mercy and the fire of anger.
> >
> >(Masnavi, I:836-837; 852)
In Sufism much of the imagery is erotic
I am glad you find some confirmation in this.
Rumi was writing about inner processes.
I appreciate that you feel you are working in this area.
Some dervishes thought (and perhaps still think) that the Sufis were inebriates because they talk so much of 'wine' and being 'drunk' and visiting the 'tavern'. Again they are talking of inner processes.
So the above is nothing to do with S&M but you can 'drink' it in this way.
I am glad once again, you find it confirms something for you.
Lobster
off to get drunk
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 06:17:28 -0500
From: "John Heaton" <cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com>
To: "John Heaton" <cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com>, "Harsha1MTM" <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com>,
<joemillerATnospamhotmail.com>, <kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com>,
<keutzerATnospameecs.berkeley.edu>
Cc: <margolisATnospamtransbay.net>
Subject: Re: kundalini questions
Message-Id: <11095989051912ATnospamspringnet1.com>
>John asking Harsha:
> What exactly is Kundalini Shakti?
John again:
Never mind. I just found and printed off your thoughts on this subject.
Boy, is this ever embarrasing! I shall go quietly into the corner and do
some reading now. :-)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 07:48:21 EDT
From: Harsha1MTM <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com>
To: cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com, joemillerATnospamhotmail.com,
kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com, keutzerATnospameecs.berkeley.edu
Cc: margolisATnospamtransbay.net
Subject: Re: kundalini questions
Message-ID: <3ea83036.3531fb86ATnospamaol.com>
In a message dated 4/13/1998 4:17:49 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com writes:
<<
>John asking Harsha:
> What exactly is Kundalini Shakti?
John again:
Never mind. I just found and printed off your thoughts on this subject.
Boy, is this ever embarrasing! I shall go quietly into the corner and do
some reading now. :-)
>>
Harsha: Shakti is the Beauty, Grace, and the Splendor of Self. John, I have
written quite a bit on the list about the Kundalini Shakti. There is also that
paper on the Kundalini Web Site (European mirror site I guess). Frans now has
my three poems to the Goddess up. He has done a beautiful job and I am
grateful. You will enjoy them but as a caution one of them contains strong
love and sensual imagery. The poetry poured forth with the inspiration of the
Shakti and is offered to all aspirants on the Shakti Path.
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 09:26:29 -0400
From: Harsh Luthar <hlutharATnospambryant.edu>
To: John Heaton <cttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com>
CC: Harsha1MTM <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com>, joemillerATnospamhotmail.com,
kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com, margolisATnospamtransbay.net
Subject: Re: kundalini questions
Message-ID: <35321284.D0575C7ATnospambryant.edu>
John Heaton wrote: In a flashing instant it was though everything was
> made of tiny dots, in this instant all the dots just tore away from each
> other and was gone....but "I" was still there. There was no darkness, no
> light, no sight, no sound, no body...just nothing.
Harsha: John, you had a beautiful experience. A Swami described a very similar
experience to me about two decades ago. He had it as a young man when he was looking
up at the sky. It started him off on his spiritual search. And Yes. The "I" is always
there. In the state of total clarity, it is there as the Big AM. Some call it OM.
Best wishes.
Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:09:45 -0700
From: Jerry Katz <umbadaATnospamns.sympatico.ca>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: I Am That
Message-ID: <35319E19.76DDATnospamns.sympatico.ca>
Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj:
"On a deeper level my experience is your experience. Dive deep within
yourself and you will find it easily and simply. Go in the direction of
'I am'."
"Give up all questions except one: 'Who am I'? After all, the only fact
you are sure of is that you are. The 'I am' is certain. The 'I am this'
is not. Struggle to find out what you are in reality."
"You cannot talk of reality as an experience. Once this is understood,
you will no longer look for being and becoming as separate and opposite.
In reality they are one and inseparable, like roots and branches of the
same tree. Both can exist only in the light of consciousness, which
again, arises in the wake of the sense of 'I am'. This is the primary
fact. If you miss it, you miss all."
About 25 more such quotes by Nisargadatta at my web site. Go to
http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/umbada
and scroll down to "'I am' Excerpts From I Am That."
Also new on the website is an early Zen poem, a Sixth Century
composition by Seng-ts'an, one of the Zen Patriarchs. Links to these two
new pages are side by side on my home page.
Thank you,
Jerry
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 09:49:19 -0400
From: Harsh Luthar <hlutharATnospambryant.edu>
To: umbadaATnospamns.sympatico.ca
CC: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: I Am That
Message-ID: <353217DE.8DAA39EBATnospambryant.edu>
Jerry Katz wrote:
> Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj:
>
> "On a deeper level my experience is your experience. Dive deep within
> yourself and you will find it easily and simply. Go in the direction of
> 'I am'."
>
> "Give up all questions except one: 'Who am I'? After all, the only fact
> you are sure of is that you are. The 'I am' is certain. The 'I am this'
> is not. Struggle to find out what you are in reality."
>
Harsha: Simple! Clear! Beautiful! Now I am in ecstasy again. God only knows
how I get any work done.
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 08:57:32 +0100
From: Kathy <deliriumATnospamfull-moon.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: all that enlightenment yadda yadda yadda
Message-ID: <3531C568.783E870DATnospamfull-moon.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
IMO (un-humble, I cannot tell a lie!)...
All the talk about what *is* and what *is not* part of enlightenment is just so much noise. I'm sittin' here this a.m. and thinking, sheesh, what a waste of bandwidth all this fussing over
"semantics"...and come to think of it, *this* post is yet another noisy waste of bandwidth itself...
"So whatsyerpoint you goofy Delirious lady?" you ask...
My point is that there may not be a point. Not with all the arguing about who did what to whom, who's a bozo and who's a saint, who's enlightened, who's ascended, who's ...
... well you get the general idea.
Hey, if I had hours of time to lay out my best theories of consciousness...I might come up with some enormously complicated schemes myself...but I think that in the end, I'd discover that
I'd been walking in ever decreasing spirals and end up right back in the big middle of *EVERYTHING*...
And then I'd go and sit in the back yard under the pecan trees and just be there...
(until that little monkey in my mind said "hey, looky there!" and I went off on another tangent)
This babble is just to say that I believe all we experience, even the seemingly endless journeys into rhetoric and philosophical windings, puts each one of us in the place we really must at
any given time, be.
Not profound, just simple...simpleminded maybe? What da heck.
Brightest Blessings--Delirium
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 08:52:14 -0500
From: John Heaton <CttlemanATnospampsbnewton.com>
To: hlutharATnospambryant.edu
CC: Harsha1MTM <Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com>, joemillerATnospamhotmail.com,
kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com, margolisATnospamtransbay.net
Subject: Re: kundalini questions
Message-ID: <3532188E.3144ATnospampsbnewton.com>
Harsh Luthar wrote:
>
> John Heaton wrote: In a flashing instant it was though everything was
>
> > made of tiny dots, in this instant all the dots just tore away from each
> > other and was gone....but "I" was still there. There was no darkness, no
> > light, no sight, no sound, no body...just nothing.
>
> Harsha: John, you had a beautiful experience. A Swami described a very similar
> experience to me about two decades ago. He had it as a young man when he was looking
> up at the sky. It started him off on his spiritual search. And Yes. The "I" is always
> there. In the state of total clarity, it is there as the Big AM. Some call it OM.
> Best wishes.
John:
Thank you Harsha. I needed to remember it and you brought it back with
your comments. It was a flash that contained infinity. Such a paradox we
are! (or is that pairaducks?...geesh, language. Pregnant with meaning
and absolutley futile...)
I am looking forward to your poetry.
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 09:10:28 -0500 (CDT)
From: hbarrettATnospamix.netcom.com (Holly N. Barrett, Ph.D.)
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: enlightening/getting lighter
Message-Id: <199804131410.JAA17181ATnospamdfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com>
I've had a gazillion hours of therapy, both as a therapist and as the
therapized. Nothing has equalled the psychological scouring that I've
experienced since k. The re-feeling of knots of pain has at times left
me on my knees shouting uncle (or, of course,
Godalmighty-allrightalready, I'm ready to give this up!), due entirely
to my own stubbornness. But the upshot is that I am a little lighter
afterwards and, over time, I see how much easier it now is to be a
little nicer. The increasing lightness is my confirmation of the
existence of Grace. Holly
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 10:31:54 PDT
From: "Joseph Miller" <joemillerATnospamhotmail.com>
To: Harsha1MTMATnospamaol.com
Cc: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: kundalini questions
Message-ID: <19980413173154.17174.qmailATnospamhotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
Harasha,
Referring to your message
>Harsha: Hi Joe. Awakening of the Kundalini Shakti in meditation leads
to an
>immediate loss of body consciousness (but not consciousness). It is
quite
>dramatic. There is no mistaking it.
>
I think you may be generalizing a personal experience to the world and
it is not necessarily valid. What you say can be true but is not
universally true for all people with awakenings. If you were talking
about Samadi I'd agree, but for most people it is years from awakening K
until Samadi.
What you say is much more likely to be valid in Ajna (but not always for
all people), and is more likely the higher the charka the person has
reached, but Kundalini can be awake and moving and not give any physical
sensation (or lack of sensations) that can't be attributed, reasonably
and logically to some other cause. This is particularly the case here K
has taken Vajra or for that matter any nadi outside Susumna and its
contained nadis.
Namaste,
Joe
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Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:43:42 -0700
From: "Mark A. Collins" <themacmanATnospammacsrule.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com
Subject: Re: kundalini questions
Message-ID: <35325CDE.23AAATnospammacsrule.com>
In terms of science, your experience was quite inline with the truth.
Matter, which is just massive amounts of highly vibrating "knots" of
energy, just has a tendancy to exist. It does not have any existence on
it's own.
There is an energy field, scientists call Zero Point Energy, that
supplies the energy necessary to keep matter from flying apart into
lower forms of energy. This ZPE exists everywhere, radiates in all
directions, and is without vibration.
ZPE, however, is malleable. It is the base energy that all matter and
higher energy is made of. But Intent (or in ACIM terms, Will) is what
manipulates ZPE. Consciousness, basically. We humans have a common
belief that this world is a certain way. Well, we're the ones who made
it that way with our belief. However, many people "believe" things
different from the norm, which allow them to do things different from
the norm. Chi, Kundalini, Psychic powers, miracles, etc.
Belief has to be of a total magnitude. One has to believe with the
totality of one's being. It looks like you did.
I was standing in my front yard breathing in the sunrise and thinking
about how
> our physical existence could be likened to a strobe light....flashing in
> and out of existence, (and how our brain convienently deletes or simply
> ignores the time we "are not here") when the 'world', myself included
> "exploded" so to speak. In a flashing instant it was though everything was
> made of tiny dots, in this instant all the dots just tore away from each
> other and was gone....but "I" was still there. There was no darkness, no
> light, no sight, no sound, no body...just nothing. Then, just as quickly,
> everything "imploded" again (like a film of the explosion running in
> reverse) and I was standing in my yard again. My stomach was churning a
> bit, and I was very light headed. My whole body felt very light (except my
> feet, which felt relatively heavy) and kinda strange, walking was plodding
> and felt very mechanical. But this soon wore off.
It looks like you, who lives in your own world, but believe it to be the
same Universe as everyone else, removed the ZPE that creates your world,
causing it to "explode" into nothing, and then reversed the process,
bringing it all back.
I stress the fact that we each live in our own separate reality. There
is no common world. We have just made it appear to be. What you have
experienced was real. You decomposed an entire Universe, and put it back
together!
How's that for an awakening Child of the Infinite? I'd say pretty darn
good!
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