1997/11/29  13:03  
 kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #774 
  
kundalini-l-d Digest				Volume 97 : Issue 774
 
Today's Topics: 
  RE: The 'I'                           [ Dieter Dambiec <d.dambiecATnospamstudent.c ] 
  RE: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771     [ Dieter Dambiec <d.dambiecATnospamstudent.c ] 
  RE: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771     [ Dieter Dambiec <d.dambiecATnospamstudent.c ] 
  aack, I finally got it already        [ hbarrettATnospamix.netcom.com (Holly N. Ba ] 
  [Fwd: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #  [ freda <fredaATnospamblarg.net> ] 
  [Fwd: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #  [ freda <fredaATnospamblarg.net> ] 
  Thanks for the welcome and the input  [ Delirium <deliriumATnospamfull-moon.com> ] 
  Heart Centered                        [ Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu> ] 
  Re: Mini or Maxi -take ya pick!       [ "Rick Puravs" <ric51ATnospamgeorge.lhi.net ] 
  Re: The 'I'                           [ "Jason S. White" <zymphtATnospambluewin.ch ] 
  Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771     [ "Jason S. White" <zymphtATnospambluewin.ch ] 
  Re: Heart Centered                    [ Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.co ] 
  Re: *>transcendent experience<* was:  [ amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us ] 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 22:51:17 +1100 
From: Dieter Dambiec <d.dambiecATnospamstudent.canberra.edu.au> 
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com 
Cc: "kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com" <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com> 
Subject: RE: The 'I' 
Message-ID: <01BCFD37.B6D0D820ATnospampppclient8.canberra.edu.au>
 
-----Original Message----- 
From:	Jason S. White [SMTP:zymphtATnospambluewin.ch]
 
Matter-energy (for example, a human being) is conscious of itself.  Why 
do we study ourselves?  Why does matter-energy study itself?
 
[Dd>]  I think you'll need to understand first that behind matter is energy  
and behind energy is consciousness.  To this end you might realise that  
human beings also have mind which is far more than matter-energy (which are  
essentially blind without mind).
 
Animate consciousness arises from metazoic structure, and so naturally we  
get complicated mind, and so finally in this world of ours, we get human  
structure. Because of this physical complexity, the mind has also become  
complex and complicated.  It has everything to do with mind, rather than  
with 'matter-energy'.
 
In this regard, human mind is related to hormones secreted from different  
glands and sub-glands; those hormones control each and every propensity of  
human mind. That is why in intuitional science/spiritual practice/medita   
tion a spiritual aspirant seeks to channelise related energies and to  
control the mind or its propensities which are being controlled by the  
glands and sub-glands.  Otherwise matter-energy is a plain mess.
 
Human beings may be intellectually developed but they function within their  
physical structures. Certain points of their brains act as nuclei, which  
help them to operate different functions and nerve cells and entire nerve  
functions. Also in a human body the controlling point is the pitutary  
gland, the seat of consciousness which controls directly the conscious  
mind, indirectly, the sub-conscious and more indirectly the unconscious.
 
Humans are more psychic oriented rather than physical (matter) oriented, ie  
the glandular structure is related to the chakras.  All tendencies of the  
mind/psychic structure can be converted into a spiritual wave. There are 50  
such tendencies.  49 of these are fundamentally 'unstable'. Only the base  
of the 50th propensity, ie 'para', (spiritual knowledge) is stable - that  
which is stable is directly related/linked to the Pure Spiritual Awareness.
 
It is that which much be achieved.  The awakening of the kundalinii is a  
movement towards that alone - pure consciousness.  People get sidetracked  
with other symptons on the way including try to get the be all and end all  
out of energy/matter manifestations. 
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 02:28:36 +1100 
From: Dieter Dambiec <d.dambiecATnospamstudent.canberra.edu.au> 
To: "'kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com'" <kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com> 
Subject: RE: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771 
Message-ID: <01BCFD37.D9C00540ATnospampppclient8.canberra.edu.au>
 
-----Original Message----- 
From:	Ruth Trimble [SMTP:trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu]
 
Ruth, thank you for your suggestions and I am *SURE other 
women would agree with* you.  And of course you  
would have a better preconception of who the audience is  
than I would and I guess I should limit myself accordingly.  
 
Your distinction between the noble Hindu and the unlearned  
American male raises doubt as to its validity as both seem to 
be equally bigoted and sexist from what I gather.  In any case if 
I were a woman I don't think I'd want to spend 3 hours with either 
of them - but I guess I can't speak for the opposite sex. 
 
And I guess 
you have more time than any us mere mortals in terms of the sexual 
hierarchy where length of time seems to play such in extremely important (or should 
I say impotent) role.  I would  
imagine that a person who has removed all mental/psychic 
disorders of the caste system methodology of the Hindu and one who is 
more caring than the favourite character of the unlearned  
American male would be a better preference.
 
In any case, I don't think I've known of a condom that's lasted for 3 hours - which I would  
gather would be a precaution that even that superhuman male of yours would wear just in case 
there was some slight slippage of semen that might spill leading to the paranoia of the rebirth 
of another child and the awful possibility of having to spend time with children thereafter (if 
of course the hormonal side effects of the pill are not of great concern to you in the first place).  But 
then again an abortion may be the price to pay for loosing those valuable 3 hours which mean  
so much more in terms of freedom of choice.  
 
Of course, time being the all important factor - what does anything else matter.  In any case I wonder how  
the measurement of time creeps into it at all if indeed the scenario portrayed is such a transcending experience.
 
In regard to the diary, it would be difficult to find as there simply 
isn't any, and what purpose would I have in writing any kind of  
autobiography - one must first acquire some mystic esteem to  
obtain a readership of that type (and undoubtedly a web page is  
needed to portray the requisite image :).
 
Time ... is it of such importance ... or is it perhaps your own dogma.
 
You know they say Love transcend time  ... or is this a realisation you care to do without.
 
dieter  
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 02:56:25 +1100 
From: Dieter Dambiec <d.dambiecATnospamstudent.canberra.edu.au> 
To: "'fredaATnospamblarg.net'" <fredaATnospamblarg.net>, 
 "'Ruth Trimble'" 
  <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu> 
Cc: "'kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com'" <kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com> 
Subject: RE: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771 
Message-ID: <01BCFD3B.9023E2E0ATnospampppclient8.canberra.edu.au>
 
-----Original Message----- 
From:	freda [SMTP:fredaATnospamblarg.net] 
oh well, thats foreplay......... and that is a natural 
funtion is it not?
 
I agree with D.D. 
>Frankly, sex is not a big deal - the inner motives for our actions is  
>what counts.
 
[Dd>]  Ms Trimble, Love is not dependent on time and if you have not  
realised that what in the *foreplay* are you trying to achieve from the  
reading of the voluminous books on the 3 hr orgasm - are these read in  
between those small moments where contemplation is possible.
 
dieter
 
PS trust my inner motives :)
 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 10:12:55 -0600 (CST) 
From: hbarrettATnospamix.netcom.com (Holly N. Barrett, Ph.D.) 
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com 
Subject: aack, I finally got it already 
Message-Id: <199711291612.KAA11742ATnospamdfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com>
 
Finally came to see a pattern that has been going on for about 6  
months:  I'll get bone-weary, feel like I'm coming down with something  
(I am, for heaven's sake!), and emotionally thin-skinned.  Worst of  
all, I feel distant from God/dess -- I don't go into complete doubt  
anymore, though, the k-awakening made those days history.  After a day  
or two of slow, inexorable sinking, a sight, a melody, or even a lucid  
dream will trigger emotional release and then a warm river of "knowing"  
that might be about my life, or humankind, or the Divine.  The insight  
is transcendent and deeply comforting. The next day I'm nearly  
physically well again.  Now, you'd think I'd be clued into what was  
going on by the hot back and the constant sexual arousal, but no, I'm  
just caught up and miserable in the little "i."  What I wonder is  
whether next time I'll have to get sick. Holly 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 09:01:08 -0800 
From: freda <fredaATnospamblarg.net> 
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com 
Subject: [Fwd: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771] 
Message-ID: <34804A54.F11ATnospamblarg.net> 
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------74741B6D357D"
 
--  
Freda  ~ BE-IS-AM 
http://www.blarg.net/~freda/01rg/hm/frhm.htm 
http://www.blarg.net/~freda/01a/mnf/mrite.htm 
ICQ # 4323543 
Received: from animal.blarg.net for freda 
 with Cubic Circle's cucipop (v1.14 1997/04/11) Fri Nov 28 22:07:01 1997 
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Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 23:40:55 -0400 
To: fredaATnospamblarg.net 
From: turtleATnospamici.net (Turtle Woman) 
Subject: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771
 
>I agree with D.D. 
>>Frankly, sex is not a big deal - the inner motives for our actions is 
>>>what counts.
 
I have to disagree sex is a big deal for me and I love it , when ever i can 
get it!!!!!!!!! 
It has always been important to me, right down to the fact that two people 
create not just another person but I believe they create another 
soul(spirit). the holy trio mind, body and soul.  That power of creations 
just knocks my sox off and even sex for fun is still creating something in 
both people ............if onlly estacy, joy,  elation than again maybe 
just trust , closenes and aceptance.  It's all good even when it isn't all 
good and two people learn more aobut each other, themselves and sex, it's 
all good in my book and I am grateful when things work out and I feel the 
need to create with another human being..................
 
just my 2 sense
 
   \----/            love and hugs, 
 <(------|=>          Turtle Woman 
   /----\                "those who know me think i am beautiful, those who 
      don't,  don't know me!!!!!"  (jcazemiro)
 
http://www.ici.net/customers/turtle 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 
>Feeling. She waits in the bridal chamber for her own true love whos name 
>is desire. 
>Desire travels afar. He will do anything for his own true love who's name 
>is feeling. 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 
And today the great Yertle, that       }{  "Always be ready to help a turtle 
 Marvelous he,Is King of the Mud.      }{  in need, you"ll never know when it 
That is all he can see.And the turtles,}{   is your turn to get under-foot" 
 of course... all the turtles are free }{          DonaldB2 
As turtles and, maybe, all creatures   }{ 
 should be.                            }{ 
    }{ 
    }{                            \----/ 
 - Dr. Seuss                           }{                         <=|------)> 
    }{                            /----\
 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 09:02:40 -0800 
From: freda <fredaATnospamblarg.net> 
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com 
Subject: [Fwd: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771] 
Message-ID: <34804AB0.4588ATnospamblarg.net> 
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------653C2F47BE"
 
--  
Freda  ~ BE-IS-AM 
http://www.blarg.net/~freda/01rg/hm/frhm.htm 
http://www.blarg.net/~freda/01a/mnf/mrite.htm 
ICQ # 4323543 
Received: from animal.blarg.net for freda 
 with Cubic Circle's cucipop (v1.14 1997/04/11) Sat Nov 29 08:47:45 1997 
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Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 11:46:59 -0400 
To: fredaATnospamblarg.net 
From: turtleATnospamici.net (Turtle Woman) 
Subject: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771
 
>Hi there again, 
>I agree sex is great, I was trying to make a point to Ruth, who seems 
>quite unable to get over her past, that sex comes in many forms, there 
>are many reasons and ways to respect and enjoy the act. The points you 
>make are well taken, I agree 100%, however I think it is a very narrow 
>minded view to assume that a quickie is somehow less desireable and 
>pitiful. 
>I was glad to hear from you again. Have a nice weekend. 
>-- 
>Freda  ~ BE-IS-AM 
>http://www.blarg.net/~freda/01rg/hm/frhm.htm 
>ICQ # 4323543
 
could you post what i sent you before to the list please, and I must say 
with you I agree when two partners know each other very well time doesn't 
hav etto be an issue, my x had my body prgramed to respond to his body and 
time was not the issue pleasure was.
 
   \----/            love and hugs, 
 <(------|=>          Turtle Woman 
   /----\                "those who know me think i am beautiful, those who 
      don't,  don't know me!!!!!"  (jcazemiro)
 
http://www.ici.net/customers/turtle 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 
>Feeling. She waits in the bridal chamber for her own true love whos name 
>is desire. 
>Desire travels afar. He will do anything for his own true love who's name 
>is feeling. 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 
And today the great Yertle, that       }{  "Always be ready to help a turtle 
 Marvelous he,Is King of the Mud.      }{  in need, you"ll never know when it 
That is all he can see.And the turtles,}{   is your turn to get under-foot" 
 of course... all the turtles are free }{          DonaldB2 
As turtles and, maybe, all creatures   }{ 
 should be.                            }{ 
    }{ 
    }{                            \----/ 
 - Dr. Seuss                           }{                         <=|------)> 
    }{                            /----\
 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 11:07:23 +0000 
From: Delirium <deliriumATnospamfull-moon.com> 
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com 
Subject: Thanks for the welcome and the input! 
Message-ID: <347FF763.AE2307B7ATnospamfull-moon.com> 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" 
 
All morning I've been reading through the responses to my newbie post of 
yesterday. I feel welcome here...which is very cool. Thanks, 
everyone...now back to my lurking so I can read some more.
 
--D 
Date: 	Sat, 29 Nov 1997 08:15:50 -1000 
From: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu> 
To: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com 
Subject: Heart Centered 
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.95q.971129081235.7805A-100000ATnospamuhunix4> 
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
 
Hi Gloria:  
Your understanding of the process of Kundalini Rising is totally awesome. 
I want to publically salute you for your unfailing adhesion to clear 
unfettered truth in these matters. 
You wrote:  
>>>You enter with security into the heart center, when thethird eye 
opens, instead of finding yourself connected into the world frequency so 
much, you find yourself connected into Divine Will. That is what God 
sees for the planet, his/her vision of potential. This same third eye 
energy will take you beyond and into working for mankind. This then 
really is a different path, one that only takes you farther and farther 
into that direct experience with God. The word love means one thing to 
one working from the solar plexus...even with advanced sight through the 
third eye, when the person is heart centered, love is entirely 
different. It is detached, impersonal, yet selfless and will to 
sacrifice, but the hitch here is ...the love quality manifests from the 
love of the Divine for humanity, instead of the personal thought, ideas, 
and manipulation that so often comes from personal love. 
>>   
I am sending a copy of this to friends and I would like to use it as a 
direct quote from you in my book on K.  Can I? 
Thanks for this. I feel you fill in many missing connections for me.  
Ruth  
***** 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 13:25:19 -0500 
From: "Rick Puravs" <ric51ATnospamgeorge.lhi.net> 
To: <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com> 
Subject: Re: Mini or Maxi -take ya pick! 
Message-ID: <01bcfcf4$258abb80$2821afcfATnospamhp-customer> 
Content-Type: text/plain; 
 charset="iso-8859-1" 
 
I think the discussion of time and sex is somewhat missing the point. Time is 
something that is at your disposal, use it as you wish. What is important here 
is intimacy and the shared experience that becomes possible when one works with ones sexual partner in this sort of way. Ongoing feedback is key, 
and the sharing has the potential to become much deeper. The boundaries 
between yourself and your partner blur and disolve.  
As i read this book...."The Multi-Orgasmic Man" by Mantak Chia...it seems very much directed at enhancing the sexual pleasure of men. The benefits to 
the female partner are also quite obvious, and i believe Mantak Chia has 
written a book on the female sexual response also (noticed it while browsing 
down the list of his books at www.amazon.com).  
What these methods work towards is to make ejacualtion a choice, and to be 
much more in touch and aware of the responses of ones own body, and by 
working with a partner of theirs as well. It also brings awareness of the difference between ejaculation and the male orgasm. This is an important 
distinction, and one that i was not really aware of before working with these 
methods. Oh sure, there were all those little waves before the big bang, and 
there was already the tendency to ride in those little waves to prolong the act, 
but this was more related to satisfying my partner rather than just to enjoy the 
little waves themselves. Well, turns out those little waves can get real big, as 
big as the big bang itself, bigger than some big bangs, and there are a lot of 
these waves, and they can go on and on and on.  
So time isn't really what matters here, much more the cooperation to make  
this sort of thing possible, it approaches bliss itself. Sure three hours is a 
possibility, or you can go 20 minutes, and be ready for more a little later.  
Not ejaculating circulates much of that energy back into the body, and this has physical and spiritual benefits as well, besides providing further enhanced stimulation. There are times that i may want to ejaculate, and my 
partner may also want this input from me. At other times the surges may just 
send one over the top (esp if one is new at this), which is ok too. It is love and 
play after all. Enhanced is kind of the keyword here. Enhanced pleasure, feelings, interaction, bonding, control, awareness, everything is enhanced. 
Rick  
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 20:03:50 +0100 
From: "Jason S. White" <zymphtATnospambluewin.ch> 
To: Dieter Dambiec <d.dambiecATnospamstudent.canberra.edu.au> 
CC: "kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com" <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com> 
Subject: Re: The 'I' 
Message-ID: <34806716.369AE73DATnospambluewin.ch> 
 
The question was:
 
>  
> Matter-energy (for example, a human being) is conscious of itself.  Why 
> do we study ourselves?  Why does matter-energy study itself? 
> 
 
Dieter Dambiec wrote:
 
<facts snipped>
 
>  
> of the 50th propensity, ie 'para', (spiritual knowledge) is stable - that 
> which is stable is directly related/linked to the Pure Spiritual Awareness. 
>  
> It is that which much be achieved.  The awakening of the kundalinii is a 
> movement towards that alone - pure consciousness.  People get sidetracked 
> with other symptons on the way including try to get the be all and end all 
> out of energy/matter manifestations.
 
Excellent explanation.  Very linear and logical.  But it still begs the 
question.
 
It can be entertaining to conjecture answers to the question, but I 
don't think there is a single, precise, logical answer.  You can talk 
hormones, quantum physics and other facts until you're blue in the face, 
but at some point you will reach non-linearity, irrationality.
 
For example, what is the boundary between Pure Spiritual Awareness and 
normal awareness?  When can we say we have crossed it?  It's not a 
question that has a precise, logical answer.
 
Another example: we are aware of the known and the unknown, but what is 
their shadow.  Every day we move some of the unknown into the known, 
thus the unknown is clearly knowable.  But what is unknowable?  In our 
dualistic universe there must exist manifestation, anti-ideas, 
anti-facts which are beyond the ability of our consciousness to grasp.
 
The more closely we look at the universe and the consciousness it 
reflects, the more of an unfathomable mystery it is.  Regardless of the 
mountains of facts uncover.  Trying to explain the mystery with our 
hard-found facts is a reaction to the fear that we are not in control 
and that we don't know everything.
 
Jason. 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 20:03:42 +0100 
From: "Jason S. White" <zymphtATnospambluewin.ch> 
To: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu> 
CC: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com 
Subject: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #771 
Message-ID: <3480670E.3684D5A8ATnospambluewin.ch> 
 
Ruth Trimble wrote: 
>  
>  If more 
> American men learned this I am certain there would be a whole lot fewer 
> divorces and sales of vibrators.. !  Who would not prefer a 3 hour orgasm 
> to a 3second sneeze? 
>  
> 
 
Only American men?
 
Ruth, you too are loved.  Regardless of the duration of your orgasms and 
sneezes.
 
By the way, my sneezes usually last much less than 3 seconds.  I wonder 
if there is a Hindu method to extend them as well......
 
Love to you. Jason. 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 11:13:22 +0100 
From: Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.com> 
To: Ruth Trimble <trimbleATnospamhawaii.edu> 
CC: kundalini-lATnospamlists.execpc.com, heartzenATnospamlistserv.servtech.com 
Subject: Re: Heart Centered 
Message-ID: <347FEAC0.349EATnospamintercomm.com> 
 
Ruth Trimble wrote:
 
>  
> Hi Gloria: 
> Your understanding of the process of Kundalini Rising is totally awesome. 
> I want to publically salute you for your unfailing adhesion to clear 
> unfettered truth in these matters. 
> You wrote: 
> >>>You enter with security into the heart center, when thethird eye 
> opens, instead of finding yourself connected into the world frequency so 
> much, you find yourself connected into Divine Will. That is what God 
> sees for the planet, his/her vision of potential. This same third eye 
> energy will take you beyond and into working for mankind. This then 
> really is a different path, one that only takes you farther and farther 
> into that direct experience with God. The word love means one thing to 
> one working from the solar plexus...even with advanced sight through the 
> third eye, when the person is heart centered, love is entirely 
> different. It is detached, impersonal, yet selfless and will to 
> sacrifice, but the hitch here is ...the love quality manifests from the 
> love of the Divine for humanity, instead of the personal thought, ideas, 
> and manipulation that so often comes from personal love. 
> >> 
> I am sending a copy of this to friends and I would like to use it as a 
> direct quote from you in my book on K.  Can I? 
> Thanks for this. I feel you fill in many missing connections for me. 
> Ruth
 
Gloria: 
 Of course you can. Our job is to bring down the light as clear as is 
humanly possible, wherever it is to flow is exactly what God intends for 
it. It is such an important question that Valerian asked, those 
questions are often more important then the answer.  
> *****
 
-- 
 
Enter The Silence to Know God ... and... accept life as the teacher.  
Gloria Joy Greco  
 e-mail me at : lodpressATnospamintercomm.com and visit our homepages at: 
http://users.intercomm.com/larryn/ 
&  
http://www.freeyellow.com/members/zg888/ 
Hope you enjoy them! 
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 14:11:43 -0600 
From: amckeonATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us 
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com 
Subject: Re: *>transcendent experience<* was:Kundalini emergence..or	  what?(a newbie post) 
Message-ID: <1331309733-27717568ATnospamhsmail.nfld.k12.mn.us> 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
 
M wrote: 
<snip> 
>7 traits of people who have had any of these types of experiences. 
>They are: 
> 
>        1.  we depersonalize love, we love without attachments or 
>conditions, this is confusing to those who were 'special' to us before the 
>event
 
I have been working on doing away with expectations for a long time, 
usually successfully. I try to give gifts without worrying about getting a 
thank you card, in more ways than one. My difficulty comes in that people 
don't believe it, because it is so foreign to their experience. They often 
think I am "up to something."
 
>        2.  boundaries, rules and limits seem irrelevant, the usual cautions 
>and abilities of discernment fade
 
And I need to be more patient with those for whom so many rules and limits 
still apply. My co-workers for instance.
 
>        3.  the past and future seem irrelevant, we look to the distance to 
>find memories and don't look directly at anyone or anything
 
I feel that way about the past, still into dreams about the future though. 
I read that book called "BE HERE NOW" by Baba Ram Dass back when I was a 
teenager, still haven't got there [ or HERE :) ], however. I often have 
that faraway look. People just assume I'm "absent minded" which makes them 
smile, or ignoring them, which pisses them off.
 
>        4.  our sensitivities enhance and expand (electrical ones too), 
>intuition increases, moves toward the psychic 
>
 
Yeah, keep hoping I'll get tougher, but the opposite keeps happening. I'm 
like a radio with too many antennas.
 
>        5.  we are less attached to the physical reality and it can take a 
>long time before we re-establish our body's importance and relevance 
>
 
Tell me about it. I often feel like a head floating in space.
 
>        6.  our personalities balance out, fewer fears, men become more 
>caring, women more assertive
 
Oh, *much* more assertive, me. Not exactly what old friends and family had 
in mind, though! :P
 
>        7.  we have difficulty communicating because we think so abstractly 
>and hear a "different drummer" 
>
 
I often only give people half a message while the rest plays in my head. I 
perceive that they will get the rest by osmosis or that they must already 
know it! It is helpful when they say "I don't get it!" Then I give them 
more words and images until they do, or at least they pretend they do to 
shut me up! ;)
 
> 
>To read this was so VALIDATING for me. 
<snip>
 
Me too! Thanks for sharing this with the list.
 
>I personally see myself in 
>every trait and now, instead of trying to overcome these 'flaws', I hope my 
>awarness of their origin will help me lead a more peaceful life.
 
I too am working on acceptance. That the weirdness that is me must be 
needed by the world or I wouldn't be here, right?
 
gratefully, 
amckeon
 
 
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