1997/05/14 18:16
kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #234
kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 97 : Issue 234
Today's Topics:
Re: Prozac and K
Panic Attacks & Fear
Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #229
Re: Image Prison
Re: Welcome Duality: Gloria's IMAGE Prison....KA-BOOOOOMMM!
Re: List Mystress IMAGE Prison....KA-BOOOOOMMM!
Re: Image Prison
Re: List Mystress IMAGE Prison....KA-BOOOOOMMM!
Re: psychiatric drugs can be useful shit...if you really want them
Re: Prozac and K
RE: Kabir
oriental music
altering ones states
What witch?
Re: Music
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 09:28:54 -0400
From: imtgATnospamjuno.com (tg xxx)
To: RWilli2ATnospamaol.com
Cc: Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Prozac and K
Message-ID: <19970514.092857.13566.52.imtgATnospamjuno.com>
Roseann....
These postings that caused so much *whatever!* must have been tough for
you to read with all the controversy going back & forth. Ken was great
and I thank him too for his support of the other side. I am so happy
you are able to relax & enjoy life now. Regarding Prozak, it was a
blessing to me many years back when I was so depressed I couldn't get out
of my funk. Within weeks of taking it, I was back to my old self, was
able to start a new career and get on with my life. I stayed on it
approximately 6 months and was lead to my spiritual pathway & new ways of
thinking for the first time in my life.
Sometimes in life we gotta do what we gotta do.
Take care,
Love,
xxxtg
"I don't suffer from insanity - I enjoy every minute of it!"
http://members.aol.com/Teeegeee/tgshome.html <~~~~ on the web now!
On Tue, 13 May 1997 21:53:29 -0400 (EDT) RWilli2ATnospamaol.com writes:
>Ken, Thank you for your thoughts and support. I am currently taking
>Paxil,
>which is a Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor. I suffer from
>anxiety and
>panic attacks and since taking Paxil, I have been able to relax for
>the first
>time in years. Now I can sit for meditation, practice yoga and enjoy
>life.
> From my point of view, my life before Paxil was not as full and
>enjoyable.
> Thanks again for your post.
>
>Love
>Roseann
>
>
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 09:00:33 -0400
From: imtgATnospamjuno.com (tg xxx)
To: Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Panic Attacks & Fear
Message-ID: <19970514.092857.13566.47.imtgATnospamjuno.com>
Ken wrote to Roseann regarding panic attacks: <<Let go of the fear and
it will let go of you.>>
This is SO true! After my K experience that frightened me to an almost
death, I had anxiety attacks for the first time in my life. I had to
sleep with two bright lights on. I couldn't go anywhere. I couldn't
read anything spiritual. It was like walking on the edge of a razor
blade where if I leaned to far to one side, I'd fall off into the abyss.
If anyone would have told me it was fear then, it wouldn't have helped me
a bit -- I KNEW I was afraid!
After about a week of this non-stop insanity, I sat down and prayed &
cried to God that this just didn't feel right - I couldn't do anything
that I loved anymore. I could barely move without freaking out. Through
the tears and pain, I asked God to help me see it differently.
Instantly, I was shown it was fear and only fear and that the fear was
not real! And I got it on the level that I needed to get it! In that
instant and recognition that the fear wasn't real, I was able to let go
of all of it right then and there.
And once the fear was gone, I was able to let go of the insanity. I
slept wonderfully from then on (with no lights), and was able to resume
*normal* (LOL) life once again.
Just another K experience,
xxxtg
As my grandfather used to say, "If we all liked the same thing, the world
would be after your grandma."
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 07:27:08 PDT
From: "Joseph Miller" <joemillerATnospamhotmail.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com, mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com
Subject: Re: kundalini-l-d Digest V97 #229
Message-Id: <199705141427.HAA06793ATnospamf4.hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
> Thankyou for taking the time to express your opinons. They are appreciated.
> I always figure that for every person who speaks up, there are a dozen
>lurkers who feel the same way and say nothing.
>
>At 08:29 13/05/97 PDT, Joseph Miller wrote:
>>Our moderator wrote:
>>> So, in case anybody doesn't know it yet, Kundalini List is owned
>>>and maintained by a <...> (ME!! ME ME ME ME!!!!!)
<snip>
>>I realize "owning the list" is a computer term, but it is an
>administrative term
>>having meaning only to the people who run the ISP and the person
>moderating the
>>list. To continually use it to define your relationship to the list and us
>can
>>have a very negative effect. <s...> Good work, good friends, good manners,
>none
>>of these can be owned they can only be experienced and enjoyed. When one
>of us
>>misses the mark on one of these points a good friend will, or should, inform
>>him/her. That is what a good list is about.
<snip>
> I understand your sensitivity to the idea of being "owned" because you
>belong to a list, and I agree completely. I would be annoyed if I thought
>the list owners of the other lists I am on considered me their property,
>too. I am sorry if my choice of words upset you,
<snip>
> I respectfully call subscribers "Members" or "Kundalites", not "My slave
>minions" or anything.
<snip>
Thanks, I was sure in my center you had no "bad" intentions. I just felt if I
didn't bring it up my thoughts might not go away on their own, me falling
somewhere on the low side of perfection and all (OK, way low).
Thank you for your kind response and again thank you for the work you do that
benefits us all.
Namaste,
Joe
---------------------------------------------------------
Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 10:26:08 -0500
From: jeannegATnospamicon.net (Jeanne Garner)
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: Image Prison
Message-Id: <199705141526.KAA08166ATnospamns2.icon.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>I've
>spent years acting like I thought the *spiritual* person should act,
>only to come to realize that I was being such a martyr!
What, you too? <laughing> What an easy trap to fall into; I've been there
too, sometimes visit it even now--is that why we laugh so hard at the Church
Lady?
Jeanne
==-* My stars!
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 02:17:10 +0100
From: Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.com>
To: Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com>,
kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com, LarryN3515ATnospamaol.com, rtrATnospammicron.net,
fullpubATnospamthegrid.net, V37PopsATnospamaol.com, pallisonATnospamtheriver.com
Subject: Re: Welcome Duality: Gloria's IMAGE Prison....KA-BOOOOOMMM!
Message-ID: <33791283.1702ATnospamintercomm.com>
Gloria Greco wrote:
>
> Oh My! Its me... Gloria
>
> I thought maybe it was over, but you aren'through are you?
> So let's go with what is coming down...
>
> I'm not going to go back through that long tirade, so I snipped the
> whole thing.. I have been snipping everyone... but let me tell you I've
> had several dreams and experiences from you coming to me in the past two
> weeks or so, AND SINCE MANY OF THE PEOPLE ON THE LIST HAVE ALSO BEEN A
> PART OF MY DREAMS in a very beautiful way, I'm going to explain some of
> this experience.
>
> First, This has been building for a while, hasn't it? The attack three
> nights ago left marks on my physical body!!! YOur visits have not been
> as a friendly list keeper but as a witch with dark intent, your responce
> to me when I brought it up to you a couple of days ago was 'my slaves
> are protective, I can't help that'. You didn't deny the projection or
> the intent...
AFter reading your next post I understand that you don't really
understand what is happening and you don't remember the actual things as
its happens. But that you are constantly getting spirits coming to you,
they are using your energy to focus and direct negative or positive
depending where you are in the moment. And that you are dabbling in your
witch beliefs(it is your fears of the past, anger about past lives,
distrust of any spiritual authority, and memories of pain...that make
you a vehicle for lower energies) I don't believe after reading your
last letter that you are all that aware. Protect yourself, don't just
open to whatever comes to you, test it first, and then work at getting
yourself into the heart center.In the heart center you won't be
thinking, feeling, or fighting, and you certainly won't hate anyone.
>
>
> The black cat being a form used by Satanic forces... wasn't just
> attacking, it was satanic and you clearly communicated your intent to me in the experience. But, you were crazy with rage, and your spiritual body or etheric energy was used. And, yet you'd say there are no lower forces,( after the other letter, you feel a connection to spirits no matter what form they come in, and a distrust for God...actually fear of God as though your creator is going to destroy you. This is probably connected to your fear and hate with orthodox religion, you need to process this out with somebody. You will carry those impressions forever unless you work through them. Ask Tom about impressions from the Eastern view, it may work you better..
Not only did you(what came through you) manifest to me, but to several
people in my group as well.
> But, you see I know that yes, it is an illusion, and yes there is
> purpose for all things. And, yes there is no accident me sending the
> mail to you. I have stayed in the flow with this to see how God
> would use it, actually feeling very positive that we could work with
> love through this and maybe build some bridges in the meantime.
I am very glad I received the direct letter from you because I can see
that you have confusion about a lot that is happening and assume I'm
having the same experience. I'm not, its different. I'm not used by
spirits that come to me, there is a very big difference in working in
Divine Will and the will of disembodied spirits.
WE are going to get through this, at some point you are going to have to
trust in your higher self, you r guardian angel if you will to get you
though this. Do you think it is fair that an unsuspecting Christian
bring up something to you that is a button and you spiritually attack
them? I have been trained in this, I brought negative spirit down
through the Christ Frequency, but not all who come on this list have
that awareness. The only way you can be certain that doesn't happen is
that you turn it over to your mother diety which I suspect is Mother
Mary. You are comfortable with female, talk to her about it. Make peace
with yourself and the Christians, you know they died right along with
the witches as did the Jews, Moslems, Indians, Tiebetans, on and on.
God Bless you. I cut about half of his letter because of your direct
letter to me. I will read it again and then get back to you.
Gloria
>
>
>
>
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 09:31:29 +0100
From: Gloria Greco <lodpressATnospamintercomm.com>
To: Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com>,
kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: List Mystress IMAGE Prison....KA-BOOOOOMMM!
Message-ID: <3379785F.15A0ATnospamintercomm.com>
Gloria Greco wrote:
>
> > (.....angelic serpent?... could it be ... SATAN???
> > Thank you, church lady...no, not really...)
> >
> > If you need more info, feel free to write to me at
> > kundalini-l-ownerATnospamexecpc.com
> > Love and electric blue K. fire, List Mystress.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> Mystress,
> Let's start out by clearing up something, I think you have done a fine
> job hosting the list, I know it takes your time and energy and each of
> us I'm sure appreciate your good intentions.
> Next, your feelings of suppression could account for the strong
> reaction to my post. I don't have a problem with anyone disagreeing with
> what I say, that is normal is it not...but maybe you will want to reflect on how this comes down into focus through you with
> so much anger and hatred fueling your thought forms. You told me your a white
> witch, well, a white witch works in the light for good which means there is a very strong abiity to purify oneself of personal thoughts and feelings. While you may work at wanting this you are full of thoughts and destructive emtoions which come in from your lower centers. Lower forces are attracted to this and manipulate you to get you into your psychic frame of mind/ emotion to use your energy and will to manifest the focusnd intent. They will feed you impressions from your past that may be total fabrication to fire you. Or they will change your thought process by bringing in a mental image or pain that you are holding inside. A flash, a memory is all that is required..he one of getting burned at the stake is one. When that trust of rage comes through with deep passion and rightousness, or maybe even fear or righteous indignation, that focus is all that is needed to empower the thought form into an all out psychic attack on another in the body or out.
> You are responsible for every thought and emotion supressed, and hidden in your subconscious which is why if you are spiritually ready to evolve... the death of self by alignment with Divine will is so very important. I know you see yourself in your form using your will as the Goddess using you, and you believe this makes you a powerful witch and likely by using kundalini you feel more power in the process. Is that really what you want to accomplish, self power...and the karma that goes with it?
Right now you met up with somebody who works with the forces from the
other side through Divine Will, this encounter didn't effect me... but
what about those who are not aware & are wide open who come on the list
trusting that they can say anything without fear of entering your wrath.
I do know your slaves... idea of submission to your will is feeding your
ego, and making you think you have obtained a level of consciousness to
manipulate this energy only into good.By becoming their owner you access
their psychic pool as well as your own and Kabooom, as you say you have
created your thought form.
You kind of think you caught me at something, which means you are
justified in going to war with me. It didn't and doesn't hurt me, I'm
protected by the Christ frequency that I live in, and rather then allow
any kind of thing to come at you, I absorbed your negative energy and
had by body disappate it. That is because I love and care about you
because this is the way God works, "thy will be done."
Probably all witches are white witches until their anger and wrath is
stirred, then the storehouse of supressed impressions becomes the fuel
to concentrate lifeforce as energy on the object of focus.
>
> That is ok, your not the first to do it, and not the last, it is very
> human, but dangerous for those working in kundalini. as well as involved with soul evolution. And, placed as an authority on a kundalini list with young and old from all over looking for answers.
>
> I did push a button but certainly speaking of the power of prayer to change life when people the list constantly ask for help, was not an out of line topic of discussion.
> Anyway, if you were persecuted and burned, like many of us have been more then once,
> it wasn't me personally that caused this action on you. So, in spite of the
> fact that I'm an Eastern/Western Christian, which is gnostic/mystic and open to communicate, it doesn't mean that what I say is personally directed to you or any other person channeling spirit force ...as a white witch or other.
> Perhaps you can share with us more of how you came into this
> experience? Gloria
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 17:15:18 +0100
From: Tom Aston <yogi.tomATnospamtantrictom.demon.co.uk>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com, Jeanne Garner <jeannegATnospamicon.net>
Subject: Re: Image Prison
Message-ID: <VKAgIAAWUeezEwmbATnospamtantrictom.demon.co.uk>
In message <199705141526.KAA08166ATnospamns2.icon.net>, Jeanne Garner
<jeannegATnospamicon.net> writes
>>I've
>>spent years acting like I thought the *spiritual* person should act,
>>only to come to realize that I was being such a martyr!
>
>What, you too? <laughing> What an easy trap to fall into; I've been there
>too, sometimes visit it even now--is that why we laugh so hard at the Church
>Lady?
>
> Jeanne
> ==-* My stars!
>
kundalini does not always take kindly to spiritual stereotypes which can
become just one more form of resistance to realising our primordial
nature.
it can be a key distinction to know when one has outgrown the
conventional forms of spirituality
and can begin to let go altogether
to make way for greater truths that defy conventional formulae
or even start to break the rules
to break down our spiritual conditioning at its deepest levels....
this is not recommended to the fainthearted
or those who value their conventional sanity
and status in society....
or who want to be respected as "normal" or "spiritual".....
and it can be an ugly and traumatic process
when one touches the shadow
as many of us know already....
kundalini can be primal
in her determination
to destroy anything that gets in her way....
including OUR SELVES
yet still we fight or hold on -
now that is crazy !
as the outcome is already decided......
kundalini wins every time.
ho hum
Crazy Tom
--
Tom Aston
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 14:29:30 -0400
From: imtgATnospamjuno.com (tg xxx)
To: Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: List Mystress IMAGE Prison....KA-BOOOOOMMM!
Message-ID: <19970514.142931.13566.56.imtgATnospamjuno.com>
Darnnit! I think you are both right.
Light side/dark side - they are all the same - everything is light -
everything is dark - it depends on how you tilt your head and look at it.
Am I being naive? I wonder..... but that's the way I see it.
It seems to me that if we place a judgement on someone being from 'the
dark side' (while putting ourselves on a pedestal of light), then that's
all it is - a judgement, which is not for us to judge. Or is it? And
then I see myself judging the judgements which is not for me to judge
either.
Heck, I'm going back to observing. Never mind. Carry on....
Big Hug,
xxxtg
"The only thing about being imperfect is the joy it brings to others."
http://members.aol.com/Teeegeee/tgshome.html <~~~~ on the web now!
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 16:48:03 -0400
From: Dolce Vita <lissetteATnospambridge.net>
To: Ken McFarland <kenmATnospamOREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
CC: Tom Aston <yogi.tomATnospamtantrictom.demon.co.uk>, kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: Re: psychiatric drugs can be useful shit...if you really want them
Message-ID: <3378D382.1426ATnospambridge.net>
They said....> >
> >"psychiatric drugs are shit"
> >
> >but a lot of us enjoy eating and wallowing in shit
> <snip>
> >i guess i'd question the roots of why people think they need prozac
> >rather than simply attacking prozac itself....
> >
> >Yogi Tom
>
> Tom, it must feel really good to be on the spiritual high road.
>
> Yesterday, I spent the entire day on the locked ward of a psychiatric
> hospital. Judging from your stated opinions, I think it might do you some
> good to do the same.
>
> Sincerely,
> Ken
Hey, were here to post opinions, not everyone has to be in agreement
with Prozac and psychiatric drugs. I dont believe Tom said that to
offend you, or your condition in particular, but it wouldn't hurt at all
if you look at other alternatives, this is what were sharing this for...
dont you think?
With Love and "respect" (very important)
Lissette
>
Date: Tue, 13 May 1997 16:56:37 -0400
From: Dolce Vita <lissetteATnospambridge.net>
To: Ken McFarland <kenmATnospamOREGON.UOREGON.EDU>
CC: Larry Killen <mosiahATnospammindspring.com>,
Kundalini List <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Prozac and K
Message-ID: <3378D585.123AATnospambridge.net>
Hi Ken
You seem to know a lot about these drugs. Believe me I respect your
opinions but I would really like to hear some other natural alternatives
to chemical imbalances. Your body is a pharmaceutical center that it
manufactures all that it needs, given the right stimuli. Dr. Chopra
talks a lot about the Ayurvedic path to healing and it works. No matter
what, I really distrust the drugs, it might be ignorance in my part, but
I have a gut feeling about them too that is very valuable to me. I hope
that you look into these paths too as an alternative someday.
My best wishes to you always, friend.
Love,
Lissette
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 16:36:19 +0100
From: bobATnospamakasha.net (bob crowder)
To: "'E Jason'" <vv60ATnospamdial.pipex.com>
Cc: "'Kundalini-l'" <Kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: RE: Kabir
Message-ID: <01BC6084.F430A6F0ATnospamBOB>
Dear Jason,
Please do know that the words are of the Mystic/Saint Kabir. The quote is just that ....a quote.
Subject: Re: Kabir
bob crowder wrote:
> The Tongue Deviseth Mischief
>
> In futile discussion is much poison;
> In much talk is great mischief.
> Keep you mouth shut; suffer all in silence;
> And remember the Name Unfathomable.
In alchemy we say:
In the beginning was the word. Before the word
was the thought.
Ed Jason
Jason,
Who is the we you are referring to here?
Word is the same as Name Unfathomable. Name, Word, Om, Holy Spirit....Nothing before this. Before the beginning.
[Bob Crowder]
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 15:35:03 PDT
From: "anita grayson" <eiregrayATnospamhotmail.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: oriental music
Message-Id: <199705142235.PAA13772ATnospamf32.hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
Everyone,
I am looking for India music. Who is a good artist. I am
mostly looking for intrumental. I found one in a book called,
"Sounds of Peace" by Nawang Khechog a former buddist monk. I have
not heard it yet.
Anita
---------------------------------------------------------
Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 21:16:53 -0700
From: E Jason <vv60ATnospamdial.pipex.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
Subject: altering ones states
Message-ID: <337A8E35.3907ATnospamdial.pipex.com>
Content-Type: message/rfc822
Content-Disposition: inline
Message-ID: <337A20B6.1D13ATnospamdial.pipex.com>
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 13:29:42 -0700
From: E Jason <vv60ATnospamdial.pipex.com>
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I; 16bit)
To: Mystress Angelique Serpent <mistressATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Subject: altering ones states.
References: <3.0.1.16.19970513040425.09af98baATnospamdomin8rex.com>
Mystress Angelique Serpent wrote:
> ((((((((Some various radical ideas on self- medication to ponder.
> Not for the faint of heart.))))))))
It is a great delight to have Angelique back in her subjective role. I
think she is doing a wonderful job, maintaining this list. She is
appreciated. I always thought she ran this list before she did ;-)
You might not agree with all her personal views but remember to send her
thanks for running this list - giving us the opputunity to disagree with
her :)
------------
Now
For those of you who feel spirituality is about sticking your head in
boiling water (ask your parents permission first children)
or using pain as a substitute for drug taking - good luck to you.
You may be K junkies. There are meditation junkies, astral junkies and
so on.
You may have a psychological or physical necessity to take Prozak or
some other medication. If you are a mess - get sorted. That is the first
step.
The fact that we are here and people have been very forthcoming about
their difficulties means they are also looking for some way of
overcoming their limitations. We are all limited; wounded by experience
and life and Kundalites undoubtedly more than most . . .
One of the great "sins" of the wounded is to try and heal others - when
it is ourselves who need the attention. We become healers, therapists,
teachers, councillors and so on.
This is dishonest. We must sort out ourselves before the offer of help
can be free, genuine and without the underlying self interest.
Therefore I would say attend to your own needs first. That does not mean
you give up your existing role but you become aware of its cause - we
offer Love and attention because we crave it - perhaps being denied it
previously.
If you do not have the strength to overcome your present difficulties
then you must ask people on this list for support.
Some of us are strong because we recognise our weaknesses but we are all
fragile inside. When we eventually rely on the Greater Strength inherent
in the Divine our strength becomes boundless . . .
GOD IS ALWAYS, ALWAYS WITH YOU
ABOVE ALL REMEMBER HER LOVE FOR YOU
Lobster (still taking the tablets . . .)
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 21:43:16 -0700
From: E Jason <vv60ATnospamdial.pipex.com>
To: kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com
CC: jan.watsonATnospamsympatico.ca
Subject: What witch?
Message-ID: <337A9464.CFDATnospamdial.pipex.com>
Gloria Greco wrote:
> Protect yourself, don't just
> open to whatever comes to you, test it first, and then work at getting
> yourself into the heart center.In the heart center you won't be
> thinking, feeling, or fighting, and you certainly won't hate anyone.
In my opinion Gloria is a Christ centered person. This means there is
only Love in her posts - however they may appear. People may not care
for A Christian Expression but it is what is behind that. What is there
- is Love.
Most Kind Regards
Ed Jason
Date: Wed, 14 May 1997 17:49:08 -0700
From: Pamela <pamelaATnospamserv.net>
To: Kundalini <kundalini-lATnospamexecpc.com>
Subject: Re: Music
Message-ID: <337A5D84.D895E132ATnospamserv.net>
I just purchased a really good cd
by Hisham Called Somewhere in a dream
Pamela
.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:.
"Life does not happen to us,
it happens from within us."
---- Mike Wickett
.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:.
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