kundalini-l-d Digest				Volume 96 : Issue 131 

Date: Tue, 03 Sep 96 
From: John Halonen 
Subject: Re: leaving & I agree, but not about leaving


Subject: Re: leaving
-
>I wanted to share with you all something I have noticed about the group.  I
don't see the group discussing the
>entity/spirit/God with as much reverance - and awe, or love (in particular)
, as I am experiencing. I could never
>speak of the energy with such hatred as I have witnessed.  Makes me wonder,
and get confused.

I see the same thing, but something has kept bugging me.  Kundalini is an
energy thing, and I think the problem some people are having is they are
confusing "Awakened kundalini"  with Spirituality, or maybe not.
Maybe I was.  But to search for kundalini or try to define it may be the
wrong path.  

For example:  What comes after "K"? (Whether talking about beginning of "K"
or the end.)
	       The rest of your life if you are still searching, because Kundalini
itself is just a manifestation.

But ask what comes after spiritual awakening?  Nothing.  You will become
awakened.  You will no longer search.  You will revel in the joy and the
moment.

There is definitely a difference between awakening kundalini and being
spiritually awakened IMO.
But both can go hand in hand and expand your awakening in both.

>Physical manifestations of God.  How can we possibly talk down to these
experiences??  Share them -
>wonder at how he has created a "pain in the neck".  Discuss about how we
can help one another overcome
>this physical manifestation.

>But I suppose this wouldn't fit into the Kundalini topic - would it??

Only if we try and define the kundalini topic :)  Because then the topic
would be defining kundalini.

Funny how kundalini rhymes with houdini.  A great escape artist.  Elusive
from the mind to define.
But you can catch it.  
You cannot catch God.  Run around trying to catch God and you will look
silly.  Because God is in everything we do.  God is everything.  But to look
for god is wrong.   

>I wanted to also tell you - before you all defend yourselves  :)  - that I
received MANY letters defending the
>Kundalini family.  I must say that I haven't witnessed such a wonderful
outpouring, and showing of love
>towards me or the group, since I've been on the group.  I had thought that
you all couldn't care less about me.
>I hardly ever get responses to my posts, and this is when I connect with
people, :( .

How could a response ever be as beautiful as your posts were.

>Thank you all for the pleasure of this final bath in your collective love :
)  Too bad you don't show it more often. Nothing is final. 
>Maybe you will try to start as of now.  :)  Obviously it is not that you
don't know HOW to show your love -
>because I received many letters which openly showed me their hearts and
souls  :)

Someone once said, "We are all one"
May all the love in the world come to you at all times.

Peace and Love,
John Halonen


-
Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 

Subject: Re: Between Lives

At 03:33 AM 9/3/96 -0700, you wrote:
>   Hi All,
>   Some people on the list have mentioned remembering past lives.
>   I myself, have never been able to do this even though I meditate
>   a half hour per day.
>   What I was wondering is, does anyone ever remember what goes on
>   between lives ?


For more information on this, read "Life Between Life".  I think it's by Ray
Moody.  Excellent book.

In love and light,


-

Date: Tue, 03 Sep 96 
From: John Halonen 
Subject: Re: Why some, not all?


Subject: Re: Why some, not all?

>Dear John,
-
>Thanks for taking the time to answer my inquiry.  Are YOU in tune to your
energy body yet?  Do YOU see
>where your physical or emotional pain is coming from?

Lately when I experience physical pain, I find I am not in the moment.  It
might sound like a lot of B.S. but it is really so easy.  I just start to
witness everything I'm doing and even the physical pain goes away.  Same for
emotional.

>I can tune in on myself & others & see it in my mind's eye, but not
"actual" seeing yet.  I'm looking forward to
>becoming more & more that energy body!

peace and love,
john halonen



Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 
From: nannuATNOSPAMsuncoastonline.com
Subject: Please help me, I'm fall-ll-ing...

Let it be,..  let it be-ee,..  let it be,..  let it be-eee,   ....there will
come an answer,  let it be-ee-eee...

How do you hope to find that which you already have? To seek it, is to lose it,
...the loss being in the very search...

Let it be,..  let it be-ee,..  let it be,..  let it be-eee,   ....there will
come an answer,  let it be-ee-eee...

Only when you  'realize'  there is nothing left to grab onto,  will the answers
make themselves known.  ...for it is only then,  that they will have the
opportunity!

Let it be,..  let it be-ee,..  let it be,..  let it be-eee,   ....there will
come an answer,  let it be-ee-eee...


-
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Mark Rivera 
Subject: Re: Cobra playing with me?!?

My friend had a dreamwith Cobras in snakes in his house and basement,
the unconscious, I told that was a ver positive K sign as is yours.

Mark 

-

Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Mark Rivera 
Subject: Re: Cobra playing with me?!?

By the way, I had a wild dream. I dreamed I past through some port hole in
time where I was in my neiborhood on my old block in the seventies. I saw
an old shop owner I remembered and her family (though their images changed
to other people, who I didn't recognize, but seem to know anyway.) I told
them and showed them what was to come in the future over the next 20 years
on that block How their store, a Deli, would be turned into a video store
when another rival deli would open, which did happen. After telling them
the changes to the block to come I followed them to a park by the sea
where a cloud was on ground level, floating. They all ran toward it to
play except for me. I thought it was odd and I think I may have been
afraid. Then I looked at the sea and saw black patches of oil burning. I
asked a person if it was oil, and the watcher said yes. Then the oil that
burned began to take a water spout, tornado formation (K) I bet, Again, I
got scared, so I got the heck out of the park, walked the family to their
home. Some reason, my jacket and shoes were off. I found the shoes and
felt a sense of urgency. I wanted to go home. But the laces her sticky
with something and I couldn't tie them correctly. Then I woke up. That's
it. Thought I'd share it. Any commentary is appreciated and welcomed.



Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: HowardCushATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Direct Experience
-
It is true, as someone wrote here recently, that no one knows anything for
sure about Kundalini.  It doesn't matter if the ideas are in thousand year
old books or a recent magazine -- they are just words.  And at best they are
just guideposts.

In my experience, the only thing I can count on, and trust, is direct
experience.  What is happening to me?  What is going on?  The books and
concepts help to give me a context, to let me know I am not alone or insane,
but as soon as they begin to prescribe "shoulds" of any kind, it's time for a
huge grain of salt.

I've been taught that there is no substitute for this simple suggestion --
pay attention.  When I pay attention to my direct experience, full open
non-directed attention, at the very least there is movement.

Some people on the list have written things recently about higher and lower
energy.  One person, Gloria, I believe, stated something and said "It is
fact."  Tom me, this is a bit scary.  If we say, this is a fact, or law,
according to my direct experience, then we are on the firm ground of our own
lives.  And isn't it possible that what is true for one is not true for
another?

I've written this from my heart, in hopes of stimulating some conversation
about it.  I've noticed, for myself, that when people speak of their own
experience on this list, I receive great gifts.  When they pontificate, or
rely on sacred texts and sources, I get a little numb.  That's just me.  How
about you all?  I'm all for gathering insight and sharing it, no matter the
source, but it always feels strongest to me when someone offers it because it
has had a profound PERSONAL impact.
-
Thanks to all for the opportunity to share this, and especially to Richard
for all his hard work in maintaining us.

Howard  



Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Wendy 
Subject: Unidentified subject!

When the wise man learns the Way,
He tries to live by it.
When the average man learns the Way,
He lives by only part of it.
When the fool learns the Way,
He laughs at it.
Yet if the fool did not laugh at it,
It would not be the Way.
Indeed, if you are seeking the Way,
Listen for the laughter of fools.

           - Lao Tsu

Listening...

Love,
Wendyfool

-

Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: SEX! I'm talking about SEX!

I think that by not treating sex as ordinary, and normal;

we both demonize it, and idealize it.

We think of it as anything other than ordinary.

Sex is ordinary.

If you don't like it, please get over it.

( tee hee )

Mac.

-

Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: Re: Loss

On Mon, 2 Sep 1996, Mary Knapp wrote:

> 
> (Not only do I believe you can drop a guru and work with God alone, I
> believe you MUST do this.)
> 

I agree. I believe this is very important; we are all so different.

Mac.



Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 
From: jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu
Subject: Re: Loss, ....oooh SHIT!, what has I got into!?..

I may not be speaking of death in the same context as below, but I have 
this thought that life and death are flip sides of the same coin.

I also believe that it's best to think about death when you feel 
better--while you Don't feel like dying.  Mabey its better to ignore 
death issues while you are feeling bad.  Think about death when you are 
feeling stronger.
-
Mac.

On Mon, 2 Sep 1996 GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:

> Mark,
> When your are wishing you are dead it is a pretty acurate thought since what
> you are working at is killing off the ego/self. If there is no ego/self,
> there is nothing to react with. So, indeed you wish that was gone. It does
> make life  more natural, and easy to move with whatever is coming down
> because there is only one thing inside not two. Duality is conflict. Unity is
> bless. Gloria
> 
> 



Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Juliet 
Subject: Re: Cobra playing with me?!?
-
Mark Rivera wrote:
> 
> By the way, I had a wild dream. I dreamed I past through some port hole in
> time where I was in my neiborhood on my old block in the seventies. I saw
> an old shop owner I remembered and her family (though their images changed
> to other people, who I didn't recognize, but seem to know anyway.) I told
> them and showed them what was to come in the future over the next 20 years
> on that block How their store, a Deli, would be turned into a video store
> when another rival deli would open, which did happen. 
-
Do you know the work of Philip K. Dick (SF writer from Bay Area)??  You
would love it!!  Try "Time Out of Joint" or, better yet, some of the
later, gnostic influence stories (my money says he had a k experience,
but didn't know it). 

J.



-
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Mark Rivera 
Subject: Re: Loss, ....oooh SHIT!, what has I got into!?..

Mac,

I agree with both your statements.

On Tue, 3 Sep 1996 jmckinnonATNOSPAMcc.weber.edu wrote:
-
> I may not be speaking of death in the same context as below, but I have 
> this thought that life and death are flip sides of the same coin.
> 
> I also believe that it's best to think about death when you feel 
> better--while you Don't feel like dying.  Mabey its better to ignore 
> death issues while you are feeling bad.  Think about death when you are 
> feeling stronger.
> 
> Mac.
> 
> On Mon, 2 Sep 1996 GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:
> 
> > Mark,
> > When your are wishing you are dead it is a pretty acurate thought since what
> > you are working at is killing off the ego/self. If there is no ego/self,
> > there is nothing to react with. So, indeed you wish that was gone. It does
> > make life  more natural, and easy to move with whatever is coming down
> > because there is only one thing inside not two. Duality is conflict. Unity is
> > bless. Gloria
> > 
> > 
> 
> 



Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Mark Rivera 
Subject: Re: Cobra playing with me?!?
-
Juliet,

I couldn't agree with you more. Philip K. Dick was definietly an
interesting, if not enlightened Sci-Fi writer. I appreciate the
recommendation. I've been looking for a good sci-fi novel to read. Are you
a sci-fi fan? I am. I can recommend great books and films. You know there
is a third film based on one of Dick's short stories. It's callled
Screamers. While not as sophistocated as Blade Runner, it doesn't
sacrifice it's social human commentary in favor of violence and action the
way Total Recall did. Though Total Recall, I think was a good film too.
I'd like to recommend a few great, classic sci-fi novels to you and all
out there:

1) Foundation Series: Asimov -Definitely the Grand Master of Sci-Fi
2) Star Maker: Olaf Stapleton - A bit long, but contains the blueprint to
many of our sci-fi stories in film and book today.
3) Martian Chronicles - Bradbury Good Story Teller and spiritual, human
message
4) 2001/2010/ChildHood's End -Arthur C. Clarke. True Sci-Fi. Clarke is
great. Childhood's End is a must! Been copied, palely by ID4 and V
5) The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch and Clans of the Alphane moon-
Philip K. Dick Anything he rights is worth reading
6)Dune Frank Herbert Classic. George lifted a lot for his Star Wars from
this.
7) Fastwalker Jaques Vallee The UFO expert to read.
8)FlatLand Edwin Abbott Briliant metaphor on interdimensional travel
9) Hitchiker Guide to the Galaxy Douglas Adams- Great spoof with real wit
and truth at the heart
10) Neuromancer William Gibson His best
-
Read'em!



Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Juliet 
Subject: Re: Direct Experience

HowardCushATNOSPAMaol.com wrote:
> 
> It is true, as someone wrote here recently, that no one knows anything for
> sure about Kundalini. 

Is this really true??  Ancient Yoga practices, which are
kundalini-oriented, are regularly described as "scientific."  Maybe they
knew (know) something we don't.

My own (direct) experience with a reputedly ancient hatha practice
called "ashtanga" yoga (I put this in quotes to distingiush from the
term as used in Patanjali) suggests this might actually be the case:

Over the course of a regular, daily practice, I have noticed that the
k-activity it promotes is actually regular and predictable.  That is to
say, I can be relatively sure that at the same point in the practice
each day, the kundalini paralell will be the same.  As the practice
matures, so (apparently) does the k (greater clarity, etc.).

This "predictablility" of kundalini is completely unknown to me in other
circumstances--and suggests that when they say that the practice is
"scientifically" designed, they may actually mean it.  The first
"ashtanga" series (the one I'm on, there are five or six) purports to be
designed to quickly cleanse the nadis and the physical body.  I can
report that it *definately* seems to be working in that way.  Obviously,
one advantage to having active kundalini is that you don't have to do a
practice like this entirely on "faith." :-)

Anyway, I guess the point is that the "ancient vedic seers" (and,
presumably, some of the modern ones who have built on this "science")
may actually have conducted some controlled studies in a scientific
manner, and in fact "know something."

J.



Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: WorcaATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: has anyone else felt this?

Snowbird, (what a beautiful nickname!)

In my own experience in dealing with energy running through, & the feeling of
being engulfed, I have found that my inner voice about "what technique to
use" is the authority on what is best for me at a particular time, not some
book or guru, although those things have been helpful to form new ideas from.
 The techniques I use work for only a time too, as I am ever changing, my
techniques need to keep up with me as well!  I guess I have the feeling that
I'd rather get a few days relief (or weeks), even if I know it won't last
forever.
-
As for being lucky that some of us have visits from angels & guides, they
have never "healed" me, but like a book or guru, have given ideas for ME to
work with in my own way.  I still go through rotten days - having angels
and/or guides around has not lessened that.  They are there only to help me
through my process, not pull me up out of it.

And by the way, I KNOW that you have angels around you as well, you just
haven't been aware that they are there.  They would LOVE to speak with you,
if you will but open the lines of communication!  If at first it feels like
you're pretending/imagining, that's normal - keep at it; soon even that will
change.  ("fake it till you make it" comes to mind here)  You'll know when
it's real by listening to your heart.  You'll be surprised how much 'real
stuff' comes through even when you feel like you're imagining it!

Angels' Blessings,  Barb



Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 
From: Juliet 
Subject: KRN

Dan Gahlinger wrote:

I'll let you know if there is a San Fran office.

Actually, let me know if there's a LA office (I'm in Venice).  Or,
maybe  we could email the SEN at their Santa Cruz place (I saw a
website).  I'll try this and report back, in case others are
interested--

J.