Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 96 : Issue 55 [1] From: LwMema3ATNOSPAMaol.com Subject: Thank you Everyone! Re: Seizures This is a thank you note to everyone who posted such wonderful responses to my question regarding K and seizures. I would like to thank you all individually and respond to what you said.--- Michelle- Thank you so much for the adcice and words of love. I do work with my angels and ask their guidance and look forward to the arrival of those you mentioned. Thank you for the healing energy you asked to be sent to me. All your light and love is greatly appreciated. Karol Ann- Thank you for your suggestions to the try the Healthy Net, I am looking in to it, and for the bouquet of love. :D Omar- You might be interested to know that I will be going to Kauai, HI in a few weeks to do exactly what you suggested- rest, and work with other healers. Yes, I do need a rest and think you were quite right to pick up on some of my depleated energy. It always soars when I am in a place like Kauai and I am able to hold a stronger connection for a long time after visiting there. It is a wonderful place filled with healing and love energies. Thank you very much! James- Thank you for sharing your story with me. Just a bit of info, I have found that 5 element accupuncture works the best for me as well. :D Sending love in return! Gloria- Electicity is an idea that I have not head of before, I will see what I can learn about it- thank you for the suggesstion! Your story/ experience with light is a very important one, I am glad you shared it with me (us) :D. I too must be careful with flashing lights, esp. strobe lights. I agree with your choice not to do another test, conventional medicine can be off base sometimes- which leads to so many mis- diagnoses, which I wonder and am beginning to believe is the case with me. Thank you again for your light and love! To everyone on the list- Light & Love to You! If anyone has any additional ideas regarding K and Seizures- let me know! All your support is so appreciated by me!!! Lori :D [2] From: Natha Bhaktyananda Subject: Re: Gender differences in the k? To Patti, Absolutely -- both man and women have equal abilities in awakening and rising kundalini shakti. It is not only "me and my lineage of teaching" (which does not exist as such) who asserts that, but the entire Yogic and Tantric tradition. Practice and experience show sometimes minor differences: women tend to experience faster than men the awakening of kundalini, but often get troubles when it comes at the level of vishuddha chakra. Men are more slow with it and experience a lot of problems with the opening of muladhara chakra, but then tend to go more smoothly. Therefore there is no form of "sexism" (as your question seems to inquire) in the teaching for kundalini-rising, since we are all children of the same God... And one more mention here: -------------------------- You write: Thank you for your patience in explaining your tradition to us. -------------------------- I have not explained my (?!) tradition to you or to the list. That is a largely esoteric matter, and can hardly be done via Internet. Until now I have just quoted some elementary facts from the Tantric and Yogic tradition, which must be common lore for the students in Kundalini -- since there seemed to be a lack of it. And I can assure you that there is nothing such as *my* tradition concerning kundalini. It is as if we'd talk about "*my* tradition concerning electricity", since kundalini is also an objective energy of the Universe; we are talking here about THE tradition concerning kundalini -- the one and only! With spiritual greetings, -- Natha Bhaktyananda Købmagergade 28, 2., 1150 K Denmark Tf.: (45) 33930858, Fax: (45) 33930668 [3] From: Melissa Ann FornofSubject: more sex and K My husband has been hogging the computer the entire weekend, so I haven't yet had a chance to post. I just got the weekend's messages today--over 90! Whew! First I'd like to apologize for my last post. Richard made a comment about personalities--that is NOT my personality. I am normally calm, rational, and soft-spoken. I'm not prone to such emotioanal outbursts. I could have and should have found a much nicer way to say what I was trying to say. I haven't been myself this last month, the last week in particular. Not enough sleep, plagued with bad dreams, emotional turmoil for seemingly no reason. Maybe it's a K cleansing of some sort--I don't know. I haven't had very many physical manifestations, and only very mild ones when I do. All I can say is I'm sorry for the manner in which I spoke and that is NOT at all like me. Also, I wanted to clear up one point--I was not offended by David's ideas--they're just another opinion like any other to me. I was upset because he seemed to say that he was disturbed by one line of discussion and therefore discredited the entire group, as if everyone on it believed the exact same way. That is what offended me. Still, I did not respond in a loving manner (more like a crazy person, which I sorta was, I guess!) and, again, I apologize. As for the sex issue, I enjoyed all the conversation on it even though it was uncomfortable for me, because I don't know what the real connection is, if any, between sex and the K. Now I am just more confused than ever. Some views seem to think sex itself is bad or wrong--at least if you actually enjoy it for sheer physical, worldly pleasure. Is it? Some used various sexual methods to reach higher states of consciousness/enlightenment/whatever. Others say this is impossible or inadvisable or dangerous or bordering on perversion. Which of these is true? Is it wrong to occasionally indulge in pure physical pleasure with the one you love? We ARE still human, after all, no matter how spiritual we try to become. Some say basically that sex is sex, and Kundalini is Kundalini and the two are not or should not be connected. Which is true? There was also much talk of vulgarity and perversion vs. purity and sacredness. Who is the judge of what is and what isn't any one of these? One person's idea of purity may be seen as prudishness by others; one person's idea of vulgarity may be seen as normal by others. So how do we judge whether or not our sexual practices, whether for physical, emotional, or spiritual purposes, (or any combination) are "pure," "right," "divine," etc. Surely no one on a spiritual journey wants to be practicing "vulgar" behavior. So who knows what is and what isn't "proper sexual behavior?" Is there one Absolute Truth, or is every person their own judge? If there is one Absolute Truth, who knows it and how is everyone else supposed to know who has it? I suppose God/All That Is knows the Absolute Truth, but he/she/they/it doesn't talk to people directly, (as far as I know) so then which teachers/guides/spiritual leaders/friends/Kundalini experiencers should we listen to? I think the subject of sex is so touchy because everyone has a different idea of what is pure and what isn't, what is spiritual and what isn't, what is vulgar and what isn't, etc. I have to be my own judge of truth until I know who else to listen to. For me, sex is a physical, emotional, and somewhat spiritual experience shared with my husband; completely separate from Kundalini. This may not be the truth for other people, and I have to accept that without judgement. After all, I can say with certainty that _I_ don't have the Absolute Truth. Love to all, Melissa [4] From: Iver Juster Subject: Gender differences in the K, Gurumayi Natha, Thank you for your reply. First I wish to assure you I meant no harm with my question. I believe it is a loving thing to do to clear up any questions one might have about another before leaping to conclusions. I do not want others to pass judgement on me without checking out what I have to say on a subject, and therefore do not wish to do so on others. It is true, I have had two experiences with teachers of kundalini which did not resonate for me. One where a female disciple told me of widespread hanky panky from the head guru with his various female disciples. The other was a letter that I saw, from someone in India to a female Tantra teacher friend of mine where he asserted that women could not raise kundalini, etc. Given the many traditions in the world that make distictions between men and women and their capacity to reach, and give service to God (Catholicism, Buddism and these 2 questionable Kundalini yogis, to name a few) I wanted to know how you felt, so that I would *not* jump to conclusions! Whatever you would have said would be fine with me, becuase I get you as a good person, and I can allow other people to feel as they did. There is great value in many great traditions. I simply wanted to get to know you better. Of course, I must admit, I was glad you didn't discrimate, (personal bias) and was interested in your observations on the different challenges the two sexes face. In fact, I was fascnited with your reply. PS We are all sexist, including me. Sexist just means making discerning judgements on the basis of sex. That is different from being chauvinists, who believe that women are inferior to men. Thanks again for your input. In love and light, Patti .................................................................. Re Gurumayi I am certain that I got shaktipat from one of Muktananda's disciples. (Gurumayi is the current sucessor to him.) From first hand experience, that shaktipat is a powerful KO. If that is what you want, go for it!!!!!!! Best again, Patti [5] From: Graham Dumpleton Subject: Re: Confusion in the light Natha Bhaktyananda wrote: > > Second observation: chakra-s do not get torn, neither do they get "seated > back" in some previous position. I cannot deny that maybe you felt *as > if* it was so, but please try to realise that a chakra (and the nadi-s > or meridians) are structures of energy, same as a magnet is surrounded by > a magnetic field. One cannot tear apart this magnetic field, nor "set it > back in its original position". To bring such physiological > images into the refined work of the chakra-s means to hugely diminish > one's understanding about their mysterious reality; we can speak about: > blockages of the channels, defective resonances, impurities at the level > of the chakra-s, and a lot of other problems, but to say that they get > displaced like let us say a kidney or so, is a large misunderstanding. > You don't have to take my word for it; please check the entire > tradition and all the great Masters, and you will get the confirmation. Any term people choose to use to explain what is happening to someone's subtle body is likely to be inadequate. Simply because a specific term does not appear in someones vocabulary doesn't mean that it should be ignored completely and discredited. Such it is that the word "tear" should not be taken literally. It is a term which someone has used at some point whether it be an adequate description or not. The issue is that it has come to be used quite widely and thus rather than saying it is incorrect or that it should be ignored, people should at least be made aware than when the term is used that the person using it is trying to get across the message that you have done something to your subtle energy body so as to cause some sort of imbalance from which you may feel some effect in the physical. Further, that when they use this term, that the person using it regards it as being an imbalance in the subtle body which should not be ignored and which through some means should be corrected. In spiritual matters, or any matter, one has to be cognizant that there are widely differing viewpoints and language to describe those viewpoints. If you're going to try and help someone, you should try and use the language which they use. What effect are you likely to have on a person if you rebuff their ideas because you disagree with the language they use? Rather than say that an idea is wrong or that the person is wrong, all you should try to do is indicate that within a different viewpoint that such a thing is perceived differently and illustrate through example or otherwise. By not making a judgement on the actual idea or the person but simply providing them with new information, it will allow them to look non judgementally at what you have said and without predjudice look at how what you have said integrates in with their own beliefs. They may decide that what you have said doesn't feel right, or they may adopt all or some part of it. Whatever they do, it is up to the recipient of the information to judge whether the information as it stands is acceptable to them. All you can do is present the information to them, one should never judge for another what is correct in incorrect. -- Graham Dumpleton (grahamdATNOSPAMdscpl.com.au) [6] From: Wendy Subject: With Thanks Hello to all, I'm enjoying the recent posts. Lots of variety of viewpoints, information, opinions, references, insights, good thoughts and feelings. Special thanks to Jule and Natha for your feedback to me about tears. Wendy URL: http://www.tiac.net/users/wenders __________________________ Don't take advice, take a chance, roll the dice, learn to dance. - David Wilcox __________________________ [7] From: V487ATNOSPAMaol.com Subject: Re: more sex and K HI: Melissa Ann Fornof What a little sleep can do. I send you my love. Von [8] From: cmwithATNOSPAMcris.com (Michelle Withers) Subject: a few pondering questions Dear all, I am wondering if this is the right group for me. What do you all think about the ideas that the world is surrounded by a very active spiritual presence which is speeding up our spiritual "awakening"? I believe that in years past it took very practiced methods and many years to achieve what is spontaniously happening to many whom I have come across, and to myself included. I believe that God is sending us this opportunity to help us to save ourselves. I do not believe that I am psychologically imbalanced, and delusional, nor do I think I needed to follow any particular doctrine to achieve what I have within myself - and I might add that I didn't force any of the mystical experiences I have had, they all came spontaniously. In fact I think I was one of the lucky ones to have NOT been able to connect with anyone who was going through "magical" types of things while I was in my most active phase, in this journey of ours. It was a blessing in disquise - I thought I was MAD - seeing visions, hearing heaven, seeing auras, feeling heaven moving within my body, loving me unconditionally. I wanted despiritely for someone to tell me what was going on, but I couldn't find a group at the time. Heaven and time sorted it all out for me, and I found the answers from within my own soul. Is this a group which is trying to follow a specific guideline for awakening the "kundalini" energy? I had thought that we were trying NOT to define it so rigidly, because we are all so different, and have lead such different lives (plural), that only WE could possibly know what WE are about within. I haven't read any books on awakening any energies, and yet I have accomplished - without knowing - many mysteries which people seem to have studied for years to accomplish. I am having a wonderful time with these new magical loving angels/energies which are a part of my new reality, I just wonder if anyone on this group is interested in these types of awakenings/experiences? My experiences don't fit into ANY type of teaching/doctrine, and I am sure that someone would denounce them as maddness. In my belief system, we are ALL going to be opening a gateway to heaven within ourselves, so we can feel/know just a little bit more of our spirit, and maybe we will be able to live together in harmony better - anything would be an improvement on the way the world is headed. Waiting and wondering, Michelle [9] From: Iver Juster Subject: A few pondering questions Michelle, If the k is like the light inside the diamond, then each of us sees it through our own facet. Other facets gives us new windows... I have a viewpoint that as long as we all allow for others, each of us can reveal our own kundalini experiences and not be redundant or competitive. The collective is a collaged set of hyperlinks that take us into many wonderful and different experiences. Great question. Love, Patti