Date: Sun, 14 Jul kundalini-l-d Digest Volume 96 : Issue 51
[1] From: kashiATNOSPAMlava.net (David A. Katz)
Subject: A Final Message Before I Go
Dear Eveyone,
This will probably be my last message to the group (a great cheer goes
up from the crowd!). I have waited and waited for someone, anyone, to take
a stand with me on this issue but noone has. To say I am in the minority is
far more than an understatement.
My decision was made for me after reading Debee's ' View' message. It
is clear that most if not all of the listmembers share this View. It is a
view which I will sum up here in less glowing terms than Debee used:
"Close your eyes and it will go away."
No need to close your eyes all. I am going away. Enjoy your freedom.
May it lead you to God's Bliss. I have nothing but love for all of you,
though sharp disagreements with some. Disagreements are not the death of
love.
I have learned much from this list, from these discussions. I have been
inspired and guided. This discussion group has rekindled in me a degree of
the spiritual fire which has been burning very dimly of late. I am
eternally grateful to you all for this.
That being said, I must reiterate that I cannot and will not stand by
and mutely witness a celebration of neutrality. The spiritual path is the
last place one should practice neutrality on matters of principle and
practice. While this method worked for your daughter, Debee, in her
circumstances at the time, it does not work on the Path to God. There are
rules that must be followed. The rules are few, but they are set in stone.
In Vedanta it is said that one should not even let ones eyes fall upon a
member of the opposite sex, lest it inspire the thought of sex.
And I remind you all that the greatest proponent of non-violence in recent
memory, Mahatma Gandhi, stated he never stood for "passive" resistance or
passive anything. There is a time when one must stand up and shout, "No,
you are wrong, you are going the wrong way." That is what I have attempted
to do here. This notion of "live and let live" and the erroneous conclusion
that everyone's opinion is valid astound me. And my amazement has grown
with the gadual awareness that I am alone in this view on this list.
You see everyone, when I joined this list, I thought I was among people
of like mind. It has taken me a while to realize otherwise.
To those I have offended, my sincerest apologies. Interestingly,
nothing has been said of my having been offended. But this goes hand in
hand with the notion that anything goes except, God forbid, guidelines. Oh
no, you are all saying, we musn't have any guidelines for our discussions.
Let us wander any and all random by-ways on our search for God. They are
all roads after all, and who would dare say "this one leads to heaven, but
this one does not"? Well, I dare say it. And if my knowledge of the Path
is not welcome here then I will go on alone. It is very strange, you are
all crying out for a map to paradise, but when someone shouts "you are going
the wrong way" you are outraged.
I will linger for a while (like a bad cold). But I will contribute no
more. And, in a few days, even the lingering will end. If any of you would
like to keep in touch, please do. My e-mail address is kashiATNOSPAMlava.net
God bless you all with an ever-increasing awareness of His/Her Light and
Joy within your hearts.
With Sincere Gratitude,
David
---------------------------------------------------------------
> Once many years ago, my daughter (now 19) returned home from
>elementary school in tears. Her tiny world was being torn apart. I knew
>in my heart that "This too shall pass" and that it wasn't anything of
>major concern, but on the outside, I was very concerned and attentive to
>what she had to say. You see, while inwardly I knew this situation would
>fade into a memory, it was a very big concern in her bright, teary eyes
>and was not to be taken lightly.
> She began telling me that her friends had divided into two
>factions. I don't remember the issue which caused this division, only
>that a division was the result. They put an ultimatum to her, CHOOSE A
>SIDE. This was her dilemma. She explained to me that she had friends in
>both groups and was torn as to which side to choose. I asked her some
>questions concerning the issue. If you select side (A), will someone on
>side (B) be hurt? "Yes" was her reply. If you select side (B), will
>someone on side (A) be hurt? Once again, her reply was "Yes." I asked
>her another question. "If your feelings are hurt or you become angry
>over something someone did or did not do, which heals faster?" She
>thought on this a few moments and said, "The anger goes away faster." I
>then asked her if she wanted to risk hurting someone by making a choice.
>She answered with a firm NO.
> She was still no closer to making a decision. I asked her to
>consider not choosing a side at all. She was leaning a bit towards one
>faction in this issue already. I suggested that she maintain a neutral
>stand and not choose a side at all. I suggested that in taking this type
>of stand, people might be angry for a short while, but they wouldn't have
>to endure the hurt of 'feeling rejected'. Her tiny face lit up through
>the tears as she had not thought of this option.
> The following day I sent her off to school with an embrace, and a
>kiss. I told her I knew she'd do the right thing. The day passed and
>she returned home from school. She bounced in as if nothing in the world
>had been going on. She was so bubbly and excited. I was very curious
>and soon had the complete story. She went to school and as expected, was
>approached by her friends and asked what side she chose. She told them
>none. They were shocked! After all, she had to make a choice and her
>personal choice was not in their list of options! They were angry as we
>both suspected they might be. She explained her position to them. "If I
>choose this side, my friends in that side might be hurt. If I choose
>that side, then you might be hurt. I won't choose any side and will
>still be friends with everyone who wants to be my friend."
> The other kids were caught totally off guard. It was the act of
>not allowing herself to be caught up in the struggle which allowed the
>entire situation to diffuse. Before lunch, everyone was friends once
>again and the problem faded into a memory. My daughter however, learned
>a very important lesson in life.
>
>Limitation:
> The person who is limited in heart and thought is inclined to
>love that which is limited in life, and the weak-sighted cannot see more
>than one cubit ahead upon the path he treads, nor more than one cubit of
>the wall upon which he rests his shoulder. -- Khalil Gibran
>
>What does this have to do with Kundalini? I'll let you be the judge.
>
>Blessed Be
>
>Debee
>
>
[2] From: denise clausen
Subject: [Fwd: Earthly Beloved]
From: kentATNOSPAMgatezone.com (Spark)
Subject: Earthly Beloved
You said:
>> I had an experience when in the arms of an earthly beloved! It felt
>as thou I had become totally meshed as one with the other party.I had a
>feeling of being lifted up into the heavens and that they all were
>watching this act of love. By now I was feeling not where I began or
>where the other was begining, there was no way for me to tell there
>difference between where my lover began or where I ended, we were truly
>one for a brief moment being observed by the divine.
Denise,
This sounds beautiful! I wish you'd share this with the list, but I
understand that it seems like some might judge or evaluate it in a way that
might be painful. I'm glad you shared it with me.
I think sex (and lots of other things) can be sacred or not and neither
way is right or wrong or needs to be limited.
Hope you consider posting it and helping people to realize there is
nothing to be afraid of.
thanks again
kent
Private Communication GateZone Communications
___________________________
Internet, network, database tools, and the
training to make them work for you and your organization.
___________________________
Kent Livingston kentATNOSPAMgatezone.com 512.443.8855
[3] From: Wendy
Subject: Third Eye
I find, for me, that talking about the sacred is a bit more difficult to put
into words....talking about sex is relatively simple.
I'm a newbie here and I'm interested in learning the basics as well as the
complexities of K. (no, not you Kent)
Anyone know anything about 'blowing out' the third eye?
Thanks, in advance,
Wendy
URL: http://www.tiac.net/users/wenders
Don't take advice, take a chance, roll the dice, learn to dance.
- David Wilcox
__________________________
Language is a virus from outer space.
William Burroughs
__________________________
[4] From: ravenATNOSPAMsedona.net (katie rose)
Subject: diversity and farewell
i am not sure why i am bothering to send this as it is my introductory post
and farewell at the same time. nevertheless...here it is.
everyone on the list has their own experience and level of understanding and
that means myriad different opinions and feelings and understandings are
held about a given topic. i certainly have my own strong feelings and
opinions, so some posts i like/agree with or dislike/disagree with, some
uplift me, disappoint me, puzzle me, bore me etc etc. but i realize i cannot
assume that this list will be any different than the world at large where
diversity is the name of the game. just because everyone here is interested
in kundalini doesn't mean that they share similar values or understandings.
the list is a mixture of people in different places mentally, emotionally,
spiritually. (and additionally, here there are a great number of strong
personalities with which to deal.) participating in a list can be
enlivening and stimulating, but it can also sometimes be frustrating,
infuriating, boring etc. in any case, consensus and homogeneity is unlikely
and also not necessarily desirable in a forum such as this. short of living
comfortably with that, there is always the delete key; and when it gets too
uncomfortable, then the delete key may no longer suffice and it could be
time for some individuals to take a break or move on. in my case
"uncomfortable" means that at this time the list does not feel like a good
fit, not that it is bad in any sense.
when something on the list is not according to one's tastes, it might be
helpful to remember that "this, too, shall pass". putting people down
and/or criticizing them and their ideas has probably never changed a single
mind or heart. and feeding the dragon (metaphorically speaking) only makes
him/the topic grow stronger.
of course, the preoccupation with the current topic and the number of
charged responses it has generated, certainly indicates how powerful an
energy focus it is for many at this time. and in that light, no doubt it is
relevant to the list as it is at this moment.
katie rose
*******************
katie rose
ravenATNOSPAMsedona.net
"Love is the reflection of God's unity in the world of duality. It
constitutes the entire significance of creation." (Meher Baba)
[5] From: DOROTHY BATES
Subject: Re: SEN
Dear Craig: I called SEN after my third intense Kundalini bout (5 months
duration) and was given the name of a therapist here. I saw her once and it
was quite helpful. After that, I signed up with SEN as a Listener, which
has led many people to call me and I feel that the exchange between those
of us who have had extreme experiences is the Most helpful thing of all.
Listeners don't get paid..we pay dues to be listed and our purpose is service.
I had hoped that this list would include some of the people who read Shared
Transformation and the SEN Newsletter, there are thousands of people all over
the place who have experienced debilitating and sometimes quite horrific
experiences with the rising of Kundalini without Any effort to do so. Some
of the people I have talked to have had No interest in spiritual practice
at all..but the Goddess drops in just the same. At the moment I have a regular
phone contact with a woman who has been completely overwhelmed by voices,
visions, astral beings of all kinds, past life folks, and she has been going
through this for 8 months, night and day. She has contemplated suicide as she
feels completely overwhelmed. We need Someone Somewhere who can offer some
help to her and others like her.
[6] From: Graham Dumpleton
Subject: Re: Discussion of sexual activity.
Swenson O wrote:
> In my understanding (please correct me if I am wrong) the practice of
> raising the kundalini as a spiritual practice is a conscious connecting
> of heaven and earth, metaphorically speaking.
But what is heaven? The purpose of the spiritual path, of which the
raising of the Kundalini is only one of many possible spiritual practices,
is to achieve enlightenment. That is, to transcend our physical limitations
and understand what we are and from whence we have come. It is to get the
bigger picture so to speak, to be able to answer the question of what
heaven may actually be. It is the identity that God is within everything
and since God is within us, that we are also God. Even once you have been
there, you will not though truly be able understand it, as our individual
mind is incapable of comprehending the imensity of what God is. The
impression of what you get will only be a mere reflection of the whole,
even so, you will be fulled with the essence of God, which is love. Try
and explain it to someone else and you will not succeed, as there will
be no words you can use to convey what you experience.
> This is supposedly done
> through a conscious effort of the will where the kundalini energy is
> guided through the bio-magnetic counterpart of the spinal cord. ...
>
> In an earlier posting I suggested that the kundalini energy is a neutral
> energy and that it places no judgement of its use. The responsibility
> for directing this energy to whatever use lies with the individual in
> question. ...
>
> I suggest that the kundalini energy can be used to stimulate whatever
> energy centre in the body and because of the ease of which the sexual
> energies can be aroused the flow of energy is the greatest to this
> particular centre.
The flow of Kundalini energy in the body can be likened to the flow of
water in a river. As such, ask yourself how hard would it be for you to
divert the flow of a river to water a field of crops if all you had were
some simple tools and you hands? The answer to this question depends on
how powerful the flow of the river is, how much of the flow you try to
divert, the shape of the land in the area in which you wish to
divert it and how much effort you put in to preparing the new course
for the water to flow. If the land is flat, the river slow moving
and you have invested an adequate amount of effort in preparing a small
canal with strong sides, you may well be successful. However, if you
try and divert the river where the river is running fast and with much
energy, or you try and divert too much of the rivers flow and your canal
has been inadequately prepared, the force of the water as it flows will
quickly erode away your canal, overflowing its banks and inundating your
crops and destroying them.
As with the flow of water in a river, you cannot forget that Kundalini
has its own energy and if you are inadequately prepared for it or you
try and divert it in a way which is not natural for it to flow given
the obstructions which may exist in its path, it will find its own course.
The majority of spiritual practicies are not related to the raising of
energies, but to the preparation of the body to be able to sustain the
increased flow of the energies when they are raised. The practices of
Yoga are like a diet, if you want to be balanced and become healthier,
you cannot simply pick and choose those bits of the diet you like.
Ultimately, this is why you will find so much emphasis on the need to
have a Guru to initiate you into Kundalini. The Guru is there to ensure
that you are disciplined and live life in a balanced manner such that
you are adequately prepared to receive the increased flow of energy
resulting from the activation of Kundalini in the body. Not following
the diet and adequatetly preparing your body, before consciously using
your will through exercies to raise the Kundalini can be full of danger.
There are many accounts in the literature of what effect the Kundalini
can have on the body when it has not necessarily been adequately prepared
by the removal of the obstacles to its flow. The most well known of these
would be that of Gopi Krishna. From reading the literature though, one
would think that the raising of the Kundalini is always dangerous. This
is not necessarily the case, it is only because it seems to be a nature
of society that it is always the negative which is emphasised. There
are probably just as many people who have had uneventful Kundalini
awakenings which we do not hear about simply because there was nothing
to talk about.
Does this mean I believe that a Guru is required? No it does not.
However, by not looking towards a Guru you are taking on a much greater
responsibility as you are the one who needs to evaluate whether you are
living your life in a balanced manner and correctly addressing issues
in your life which could result in blockadges which will be an impediment
to the flow of any energy in your body. It is also not simply enough to
try and address issues that may be the result of actions in this life or a
past life. You need to look at yourself as a person and possibly modify
your outlook on life and how you behave otherwise just as quickly as you
remove old obstacles, you will replace them with new ones. The problem
is that the last thing we generally we wish to do is criticise ourselves,
find the faults in ourselves and remedy those faults. We will all too
easily blame some one else for our problems. This may satisfy your ego,
but it does nothing to improve who you are. In the mean time the obstacles
keep mounting. Working with the Kundalini is therefore not just a
mechanistic process which can be followed in the form of specified
exercises. If you want to avoid the possible detrimental aspects of
Kundalini awakening you also have to work on yourself and improve
yourself, therefore adequately preparing for the Kundalini and the
increased flow of energy in your body. This will not be easy and such
a path means you take on a great deal of responsibility which otherwise
might be shouldered by a Guru who is much better than you at seeing
your own faults and be able to help you deal with them. If you persist
though along the path of self improvement, you can in time come to an
understanding of yourself and attain a connection to your higher self.
When you can achieve this, the Guru is your higher self, or in reality
you are you own Guru. Actually, your higher self is acting as you inner
Guru all along, it is because of denial and the blockadges which we
carry though, that we do not recognise this until we have sufficiently
progressed along the spiritual path.
--
Graham Dumpleton (grahamdATNOSPAMdscpl.com.au)
[7] From: Karol Ann Barnett
Subject: Re: Are K and seizures related?
Great post, Gloria.
I think many of us have temporal lobe sensitivities. I have episodes
where I vibrate but I am conscious when I do so. Maybe epilepsy is just
a more intense experience of the energy making itself known in an already
sensitive system. Just a thought...
[8] From: Graham Dumpleton
Subject: Re: Third Eye
Wendy wrote:
> Anyone know anything about 'blowing out' the third eye?
With any spiritual practice which involves the raising of energy, there
exists the danger of tearing or damaging a chakra. Such damage
to a chakra can also result from highly traumatic or emotional events in
your life or abuse of drugs.
The result of damaging a chakra will be a decrease in its ability to
function. That is, a decrease in its ability to draw in subtle energy
as well as to keep what energy you do have. If a chakra is not repaired
it can lead to illness in the physical body. For the 'third eye' in
particular, you may initially experience headaches.
If you have good reason to suspect that you have a damaged chakra, it
is important not to pursue activities which will result in raising of
energy as the flow of energy could damage the chakra further. Thus you
should suspend for a period engaging in meditation or other Yogic
practicies such a breathing exercises. Try also to avoid conflict or
other events which may make you highly emotional.
In the case of a tear, depending on the severity of damage, the chakra
may be able to repair itself. This will depend a bit on how balanced
you are as a whole. If you are not in balance and have major blockadges in
your chakras, the imbalance in the flow of energies within the body can
result in damage to other chakras. Whether you suspect that your problems
are related to your energy bodies or not, you should seek medical advice.
In conjunction with that, if you do know a spiritual healer who you trust
and is capable of healing a torn chakra he may also be of assistance as
well. Whatever you do, do not let someone who is not experienced in dealing
with such things do energy work on you as they can cause more damage.
Major tearing of a chakra can result in a rather quick manifestation of
physical symptons. In the case of a chakra being deformed, this may not
be the case. A severe emotional event in your life could have the effect
of deforming your heart chakra. The ability of the chakra to heal itself
may depend on your ability to deal with the emotional event which caused
the problem, thereby removing blockadges from the chakra. It is not
dealing with such issues in the light of such damage in a chakra that
could lead in time to such problems as heart and lung problems or even
an actual heart attack.
To emphasise the important points, if you believe that you have torn a
chakra, refrain from doing anything which might raise energies within the
body. If you are suffering from physical symptons, see a doctor. Lastly,
do not let anyone who is inadequately trained and experienced to do
energy work on you in attempt to fix it.
--
Graham Dumpleton (grahamdATNOSPAMdscpl.com.au)
[9] From: Richard Satin
Subject: Epilepsy
On sort of a related side note, one of my son's electronic games has this
warning affixed to it:
"Certain conditions may induce undetected epileptic symptoms even in persons
who have no history of prior seizures or epilepsy...If you experience any of
the following symptoms...dizziness, altered vision, eye or muscle twitches,
loss or awareness, disorientation, any involuntary movement or convulsions,
IMMEDIATELY discontinue use and consult your physician."
I have experienced all of these (except maybe convulsions) many times in the
context of this process of awakening - though I am in good health (except
for these symptoms!!!) and have no related medical history. If there is a
link between epileptic type episodes and kundalini awakening, then perhaps
the preponderance of computers and electronic games will launch an even
greater percentage of the next generation into spontanous spiritual
development, by the reverse route. If so, then Sega unknowingly may be our
greatest ally in moving the world into the next stage. Strange bedfellows,
eh? (Sorry, I couldn't help that one...)
Richard
--
[10] From: GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: A Final Message Before I Go
David,
You must not have gotten my message, although I wrote it maybe different.
When we talked a while back and agreed to let the spirit take it's course, I
think it is being tested here is all. How can we have faith and know that
whatever is needed will come forward, if we are not tolerant and allow the
ebb and flow to take place.
I agree with you myself, my path is one of renunciation, although I have an
outstanding sexual experience with my husband. But, everything for me is
built around purity of thought, intention, commitment, and total belief and
surrender to that of divine will. And, my sexual experience has been with one
person in my life. This creates an attitude toward sexual matters, that is
somehow very different from those in our social climate of life.(married 33
years) I stayed out of this conversation because whenever you speak of
abstinence, it sounds as though one is condemning and judging sexual union.
There are so many factors that enter this conversation, such as karma,
spiritual development, knowledge of spirit, and yes, even knowledge of tantra
yoga. This yoga is not for the average person at all, especially those who
have any impurity remaining in terms of desire, etc.
Please don't leave the list feeling that you were not backed up on this. I
think the discussion has gotten tainted as the ego's and personalities begin
to clash. Take a few days, relax, and come back if it feels right. I love
talking to you and know you are a beautiful person with good intentions. Your
friend, Gloria
[11] From: GgjiATNOSPAMaol.com
Subject: Re: SEN
If you have the persons name and address I would be happy to talk to her. I
have a dear friend that had similiar experiences. A nother friend asked me to
go see her when she was in the state mental health facility. I went and
talked to her and then went back several visits. After really getting into
it, I shared some things that came to me and in nothing flat she was out of
the hospital. I had lunch with her yesterday. She thinks I'm her guardian
angel. I just helped her recognize what was taking place, and helped her
realize that not all doctors are ready to talk about such things. Gloria